Timmy elsewhere

Might be on “World Business Report” on the World Service today. Dunno what time or anything, sorry. About limiting motor size on vacuum cleaners.

Along the lines of “well if these new light bulbs, or lower power cleaners, are such a good idea then we’ll all use them, obviously. That the politicians decide to ban the older types means they must think we’re all morons, just too stupid to work it out”.

24 comments on “Timmy elsewhere

  1. A point which cannot be made often, or forcefully, enough.

    Now where’s my Smith & Wesson?

  2. I just spent a bit of time tracking the origin of this shit down, then closed all the tabs, so you’re going to have to rely on my failing memory.

    Laws are made under Progressive Government not by politicians, but by a clerisy of NGOs, pressure groups, consultants, etc. Who this time? Well the report on the next wave of the imposition of Shit Appliances is authored by two Green fronts; a consultancy called BIO owned by Deloitte Touche Thingummy and another consultancy called Oko-Institut e.V.

    Oko’s mission statement proudly declares, “In our value-driven research and consultancy work, we join with our partners and contracting entities to build foundations and strategies for ways in which the vision of sustainable development can be achieved and implemented globally, nationally and locally. We deploy our ideas, understanding and knowledge to convince stakeholders that change is necessary and to help them make that change.”

    In other words, they are green lobbyists with tentacles into both business and governments, particularly at the EU level. The EU gives them money, they produce a report which supports preconceived preferences (“our values”) and then they lobby the EU to implement it. In this case being, that nobody should be able to buy anything but Shit Appliances.

    Progressive Governance, in all its glory.

  3. Rather than look into where these regulations came from I looked into the technical aspects of them, and give or take some legitimate criticism from Dyson over the manner in which the new energy efficiency ratings are assessed, I really don’t have a problem with them.

    The only companies that will be caught out here are the ones that are still peddling outdated, inefficient and badly engineered products which rely on using larger motors to compensate for the shit design of their cleaners compared to the modern, well-engineered, efficient products produced by their competitors,and, frankly, fuck ’em – If they can’t be arsed to bring their product lines up to date then I’m not losing any sleep over it, I’ll just stick with my Dyson.

    This is one case where the new regulations are doing no more than hastening the inevitable.

  4. This is one case where the new regulations are doing no more than hastening the inevitable.

    If it’s inevitable then why do we need an army of corrupt, unaccountable, reject foreign politicians and bureaucrats to impose it on us, at our own vast expense?

  5. If companies’ products are actually shit, people won’t buy them. You don’t need to ban them. Putting a maximum power rating on anything is ridiculous. If I want a 3KW kettle, I’ll fucking buy one thanks, and that’s the end of the matter.

  6. Bugger a 3KW kettle, I want a 20KW one. Nought to boiling in under 10 seconds. We could use a capacitor in the base to charge over time so it doesn’t blow the fuses in the house.

  7. It is not possible for appliances that turn electricity into heat, kettles, hair dryers etc, to be inefficient, because inefficiency in electrical machines is heat.

    There is precisely no point whatsoever in using a 2kw kettle instead of a 3kw, the energy consumption will be the same, the 2kw kettle will just take longer. (In fact the 3kw will be slightly more efficient because by heating quicker the losses will be less.)

    Effing geniuses.

  8. I’m waiting for Unity to explain how apparently vast numbers of manufacturers are so bad at designing their products that they are using motors which are 240% overrated (presumably that’s all going in heating losses). What’s the problem, Unity? Impeller design?

  9. Surely this is only true if consumers are perfectly informed about the market at hand ?

    In this example if consumers are more led by wattage than anything else there is no spur for a manufacturer to innovate and be more efficient, because “yay look, smaller motor” won’t encourage consumers to buy your product.

    Alex

  10. Ah, the myth of perfect information.

    Because manufacturers prefer selling duff products, and only the State in its wisdom knows what they ought to be selling. Sigh.

    “Yay, smaller motor” is an obvious selling point, on “cheaper to run”. With rising energy bills, that’s a pretty good selling point. If I had an impeller system that was 2.4 times the efficiency of my competitor’s it would be all over the advertising.

    And that’s not to mention that the smaller motors are cheaper to produce, so I can undercut my competitors. And they’re smaller and lighter, so the machine is less heavy and awkward. And with less waste heat to get rid of, probably more reliable too.

    But no, capitalist businesses are just like in Captain Planet. They want to destroy the environment, and they are only interested in harming consumers. Luckily the lobbyists at Deloitte and Okeo are here to save us.

    Or possibly, to just lumber us with shit electrical appliances, in the name of saving Mother Earth. Which is more likely.

  11. In the case of vacuum cleaners, I think there is probably a point to lower powers because the average joe (or joeess) will not spend much longer to clean up with a lower wattage machine than they do now with a higher wattage. They’ll just say, oh fuck it I’ve done my 3 hours hoovering even if the carpet ain’t so clean.

    With kettles, hairdryers etc, it’s bonkers to lower the power. It takes the same energy/power to boil a quantity of water however powerful the wattage of the kettle.

  12. These policies are a nonsense. As with choosing between cap and trade and an emissions tax but our betters instead choosing both, the power of hoovers can be dealt with either by higher energy prices or mandated lower power products and again our betters have chosen both.

    I have seen mention elsewhere that domestic US hoovers are already limited to something like 1000W presumably due to current issues. Might this be a roundabout way of harmonising regulations?

  13. “It takes the same energy/power to boil a quantity of water however powerful the wattage of the kettle.”
    As R le J points out, this isn’t true. Whether a kettle boils depends on whether you can get more heat in the water than the kettle is losing to the surrounding environment due to radiation etc. Why it’s impossible to boil a kettle over a candle, no matter how much candle you use. The faster energy is put into the water, the less opportunity the kettle has to re-radiate that energy – thus the less energy used.
    If the EU really wanted to reduce the energy use, boiling kettles, it’d be looking at insulating them.
    But that’d remove all those high status, shiny, stainless steel ones from the market, wouldn’t it?

  14. I find the whole idea that there is a maximum amount of dirt per second one should be enabled to clean up comical. Whatever the efficiency of the mechanism, a more powerful machine will pick up more dirt with the same mechanism. Which is why you don’t do the whole corporate atrium floor with one of those little battery powered hand ones.

  15. Putting on my tin foil hat, I wonder if there’s a global warming issue here.

    If everyone puts on their 3kW kettle at the same time, say at the end of a major TV program in winter when the bird killers aren’t spinning the grid has to manage that peak demand. If its is only 2kW kettles then peak demand is lower, but over a longer period so easier to manage.

    OK it won’t help much but might avert the off brown out when base load is impaired by loss of coal fired power stations.

  16. It takes the same energy/power to boil a quantity of water however powerful the wattage of the kettle.

    Nope, the next move will be government intervention to fix the thermostat at 90 degrees, thus saving energy. And making everyone drink lukewarm tea.

  17. Ooh,does Tanya Beckett still do that programme, or is she just “Today” cannon fodder these days ?

  18. Concentrating on power consumption to save energy is typically innumerate bullshit. High power/low duty cycle devices like washing machines and hair dryers are stupid targets for efficiency improvements anyway. Low power/high duty cycle things aren’t much better. It’s the medium power/high duty cycle equipment that offers the most room for savings. If you can make a fridge 5% more efficient then that will exceed the nugatory savings from outlawing 2kW hair dryers.

  19. Whoops, not washing machines, vacuum cleaners. Washing machines are quite energy-hungry (water has a high heat capacity).

  20. The bastards screw us because the can. But, as observed, they don’t understand markets, so can easily be bypassed by product categorization plays (e.g. ‘rough duty’ incandescent bulbs).
    In like manner, British suppliers will now offer Henry-type 3kW Industrial Sanitation Devices on Amazon.

  21. “In our value-driven research” completely brazen. Peer-reviewed by others with the same ‘values’, I imagine.

    “I have values,
    You have prejudices,
    He’s a neo-liberal fanatic”

  22. “Putting on my tin foil hat…”
    Better to take it off again. The peak demand argument would only apply if 3Kw kettles were simultaneously going on at the exact end of a riveting Party Political Broadcast. Given the time to boil is only a minute, say, for a 3Kw against 1 1/2 minutes for a 2Kw, the actual load imposed varies over the boiling cycle & kettle boiling events are going to be spread over a period because household couch to kitchen distances vary….it’s going to make bugger all difference.

  23. For years now I have done my best to subvert greenery. I drive where I could walk, I often drive round the block before parking. I mix the wrng rubbish in the wrong bins.
    OK its petty and it costs me money, but the pleasure I get from undermining the green crappers even in a very small way, is worth every penny.

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