So how much of this is feminism?

Two-thirds think that GPs seeing 60 patients a day is putting people at risk, whilst 60 per cent would support more NHS funding being given to family doctors.

The number week-long waiters has risen sharply from 47million in 2013, with the delays being blamed on the fact that there are too few GPs to meet rising demand for their services.


We know
a few things about the GP workforce.

Increasing numbers of women in it for example. And increasing number of women who go part time while their children are young.

We are absolutely certain that this leads to getting fewer working hours out of each GP that is trained over their careers.

What we don’t know (or I don’t know) is whether this is actually important. For example, has the number of training places been expanded as the profession becomes increasingly feminised?

we would rather hope that it has for this is supposed to be one of the advantages of that all encompassing NHS isn’t it? That things can be planned by that omniscient State?

39 comments on “So how much of this is feminism?

  1. The demand for a free (to the user) service isn’t being met? Why ever could that be, I wonder? Only in Britain could the wealthy middle-classes who boast about the quadrupling of their house “value” object to paying a nominal charge to see a doctor, whilst at the same time wringing their hands that doctors are too busy. Damn, the UK can be fucked up sometimes.

  2. Isn’t feminism about hating men, having and wanting nothing to do with them, and if you have kids at all doing it with your lesbian partner using a sperm bank? Then suing the sperm donor for child support?

  3. Nothing to do with feminism though. We make it easier for girls to do medicine – by rewarding neat handwriting and smiling nicely for the teacher – so more girls will do medicine. But, contrary to said feminists’ dearest wishes, most girls still want to be housewives. So they become housewives who do a little light doctoring on the side for pocket money.

    Even in an Islamic society the same dumbing down of medicine would produce the same results.

  4. The NHS has long been poaching doctors and nurses from overseas. It is scandalous that insufficient places are available at British Medical Schools where each place is oversubscribed many times over. Successive governments have employed the cynical policy of saving money by importing staff whose medical education has been paid for by other, often much poorer countries.

  5. It would nice to think that that there is a maximum number of training paces available, driven by quality standards.

    I would rather wait a week than see someone who only got their qualification because a quota needed to be met so that we can have more women working part time.

  6. No the State cannot plan anything! Lets leave it to laissez faire private sector-like in the US where health costs are twice ours and according to Stacy Herbert/Max Keiser “drive-by doctoring “means you can be out cold and a doctor can walk by you and charge you a six figure fee. As Chuck Berry said, “I’m so happy to be living in the USA” Then they put him in gaol.

  7. My own limited experience of GP’s, mainly through children and ageing relatives, suggests that female GP’s are significantly more productive, particularly the foreign ones.

    The average middle-age indigenous male practice partner appears almost completely useless, even if you can get them to take an interest. It may be the tenure effect.

    They do ask if you want to see a particular doctor, but I’m not sure how to ask for “one of the foreign female ones” without causing grave offence.

  8. @DBC Reed

    The US system is bonkers, but it’s got fuck all to do with the laissez faire private sector.

    Perhaps you don’t realise the level of closed shop registration and regulation and lawyerisation that does on over there.

    Sure the State can plan things. Just not very well.

    Keiser’s a lunatic.

    Otherwise, carry on sarnt major.

  9. I am a doctor in the NHS.

    Jack C is correct. 20% of GP consultations relate to skin rashes, about 20% to women’s bits that bleed, 20% to people wanting a letter for benefits / time off, and the rest are kids with colds. So if you are a 60-year-old male who owns the building and has been doing this since you were 24 (as you could then, whereas now you can’t become a full GP until you’re around 30) the bog-standard stuff really gets boring.

    Once a week, you need to meet with the manager (sometimes your wife if it’s a small town) to figure out how many people need to be asked to stop smoking, how many diabetics need to have their feet checked, etc, otherwise you get fined.

    To answer Jack C’s question: just look at the names when you go to the practice. While you can’t always tell if someone is foreign just from the name (married, 3rd gen immig etc), they usually are happy to tell you where they went to medical school.

    @Bloke with a Boat

    While there are (discreet) quotas, nobody gets their qualification just because of them. Rather, this just excludes some excellent candidates in place of some very good ones. The problem with this country is that there is a minimum standard and everyone who meets it is considered to be equal. So even if you are way above, there is no real advantage to someone who just passes, unless you want to go to the USA.

    The reason there is a higher proportion of foreign doctors compared to other NHS staff is that (except in London) nobody comes all the way from India just to work as a hospital porter. In London they are either the spouse or parent of someone who has a desirable job, or an illegal turned legal, or here under EEA freedom of movement.

  10. DBC Reed – “No the State cannot plan anything!”

    It is remarkable the NHS cannot plan how many medical students it needs.

    “Lets leave it to laissez faire private sector-like in the US where health costs are twice ours”

    The US does not have a l-f system.

    “As Chuck Berry said, “I’m so happy to be living in the USA” Then they put him in gaol.”

    Hey, the moral of the lesson is don’t violate the Mann Act or put video cameras in the toilet bowl to tape your female customers taking a leak. Most civilised places would jail someone for that. Apart from France I suppose.

    Jack C – “My own limited experience of GP’s, mainly through children and ageing relatives, suggests that female GP’s are significantly more productive, particularly the foreign ones.”

    Last time I saw a female GP she said “let’s look what Google says shall we?” and she googled it.

    “They do ask if you want to see a particular doctor, but I’m not sure how to ask for “one of the foreign female ones” without causing grave offence.”

    Tell them your other kin is a Lesbian and so you insist on not being touched by a Palid Male.

  11. Another reason to hope Murphy’s books don’t sell well. We wouldn’t want him making so much money that his missus can retire early – that would put more strain on the Norfolk health services.

  12. “Last time I saw a female GP she said “let’s look what Google says shall we?” and she googled it.”

    Well, that may have been a quick and easy solution. It may also have been a polite way of saying, “rather than waste my time and yours with trivia, just google it you plank”.

    Besides which, the most one can seem to get out of the more moribund GP’s, is “what do you think?”.

  13. My own experience of GPs is that these days even getting to see one is like being granted an audience with the Pope. You might be blessed with a telephone conversation. Chances are if you can break through the defences enough to get into the surgery, you’ll get as far as a nurse. It’s astonishing visiting my exciting new “health centre” how brazenly it is architected and organised to prevent patients getting anywhere near the doctors.

    I wonder though how many of them really deserve that title in general practice, since their rudimentary and simplistic diagnostic skills now seem to be rather third rate compared to looking up your symptoms on the web. As anecdata; my mother diagnosed her own final cancer (bowel) and it took multiple visits to her GP to get him to agree she had anything worse than “old lady’s tummy”, which is apparently a disease that GPs believe in.

    So as a general rule, if you’re actually ill, get to casualty at the general hospital. You’ll have to wait a long time and drunks will vomit on you, but at least you’ll see a doctor.

  14. Jack C – “Well, that may have been a quick and easy solution. It may also have been a polite way of saying, “rather than waste my time and yours with trivia, just google it you plank”.”

    A quicker and easier solution would have been for her to have paid attention in class and so know what she is talking about. Given I was handing over a three figure sum for the pleasure, neither possible reason is justifiable. And of course no doctor is going to encourage any but the most determined hypochrondriac to use google. Demarcation and all that.

    “Besides which, the most one can seem to get out of the more moribund GP’s, is “what do you think?”.”

    I used to have an older male who used to say “what drugs do you want?” Don’t know if he would have followed through though. I expect there is a place for all in God’s great plan.

  15. Feminism? That’s not feminism. *This* is feminism:

    http://reason.com/blog/2014/09/25/at-u-m-sexual-violence-includes-discount

    Examples of sexual violence include: discounting the partner’s feelings regarding sex; criticizing the partner sexually; touching the partner sexually in inappropriate and uncomfortable ways; withholding sex and affection; always demanding sex; forcing partner to strip as a form of humiliation (maybe in front of children), to witness sexual acts, to participate in uncomfortable sex or sex after an episode of violence, to have sex with other people; and using objects and/or weapons to hurt during sex or threats to back up demands for sex.

    I need to go out with co-eds from U-Mich. If nothing else, banning forcing me to witness sexual acts means I won’t have to watch another episode of Bake Off again.

  16. withholding sex and affection

    Well, that’s half the wives of Britain in jail then. Well, would be if it applied to both sexes of course, anyway.

  17. As Chuck Berry said, “I’m so happy to be living in the USA” Then they put him in gaol.

    For breaching the Mann Act, in his case transporting a prostitute across state lines.

  18. For breaching the Mann Act, in his case transporting a prostitute across state lines.

    …which brings us back to Feminism, and their entirely invented “White Slave Panic” which was the motivation for this law. Now back again as “Sex Trafficking” of course.

  19. So What’s your solution Tim? Should lady doctors be spayed?

    As the son of a lady doctor I should perhaps recuse myself from this debate. But I’d point out she was still doing a little light doctoring (locums and a night shift at A&E) at the age of 75. Also my granny, who only stopped full time work at age 80 because she crashed her car and couldn’t do home visits any more.

    We’ve had female doctors for a century (Uni of Edinburgh). Nursing has been overwhelmingly female since before Florence Nightingale. Midwives have been female since forever.

    Is it beyond the wit of the NHS to learn from several thousand years of experience?

  20. “We’ve had female doctors for a century (Uni of Edinburgh). Nursing has been overwhelmingly female since before Florence Nightingale. Midwives have been female since forever.”

    You’re forgetting the step change in medicine c.1980 (give or take a decade) that moved it from being a vocation (particularly for women) to a career. Your relatives were of the former ilk, as was (and still is) my mother, an alumnus of St Thomas’ nursing school in London in the 50s. They worked for the good of the patient, not for salary or pension, often working far more hours than they were paid for, and in conditions far worse than today.

    Nowadays its all pay increases, getting up the pay scale, pension rights, and not getting your hands dirty if at all possible. Patients come a very long way down the list. We are constantly told that woman are the more caring empathetic gender – the current appalling state of patient care in the overwhelmingly female run NHS (77% women to 23% men) would appear to indicate the opposite.

  21. smfs (and others of the bar-fly element who, as usual, have n’t done any homework)
    Ignoring the main issue which is public vs private health organisation ,about which somebody commented ” Keiser’s a lunatic”( on the Tim Worstall blog!) for describing drive-by doctoring, Chuck Berry was not convicted of taking a girl over the border for the purposes of prostitution.The Mann Act was so badly framed by the usual slack jawed All American morons that you could be convicted for having sex with your girlfriend if you did it in the next state.The girl was sometimes also convicted; having driven the car could seal a girl’s fate.So large numbers of people who did n’t like sex picked on people who obviously did ,especially “womanisers”.They charged Charlie Chaplin ( a bit of Commie don’t you know/ no respect for unearned wealth); Frank Lloyd Wright (also too uppity by far: a supporter of Land Value Tax) and Jack Johnson for having sex with the girlfriend he later married.

  22. For breaching the Mann Act, in his case transporting a prostitute across state lines.
    I recall that at the time it was reported as a ‘teenage girl’ rather than a prostitute & thinking that ‘taking across a State Line’ was not one of the many possibly illegal things one might want to do with a teenage girl.

  23. Peter S
    Do you mean:
    TimW thinks lady doctors should be spayed?
    The NHS is incapable of learning anything?
    Or both?

  24. DBC, talking of homework, write 100 times:

    ‘didn’t’ not ‘did n’t’
    ‘haven’t’ not ‘have n’t’

    You fuck in g too l.

  25. @I If I were to WRITE it as you demand , ‘didn’t’ would appear as ‘did n’t,’ respecting the convention that the apostrophe represents a missing letter and “did&not” are separate words with a gap in between.The convention you are adhering to is the one they used to teach in typing classes to girls. It’s just for the look of the thing ; it is not grammatically correct.

  26. My mum had a scrabble bag of letters after her name. My Dad had so many he was at risk of being stopped by Customs for transporting excessive consonants.

    The fact is that many doctors are ludicrously over qualified for what they actually do. My mate the opthalmologist has a seven month waiting list because that yellow stuff they put in your eyes in the UK is a drug and French opticians aren’t allowed to dispense drugs.

    It’s not just the NHS, it’s a racket everywhere. Some dam will burst soon.

  27. Did not is one word ?
    Chuck Berry ,whom I have met and didn’t like much ,landed in the slammer because of the Mann Act in the 1960’s.BTW I don’t think Phil Spector got any justice either.The Yanks go after anybody who acts consciously superior in some respect (which applies to Chaplin, Lloyd Wright, Chuck Berry, Jack Johnson, and Spector)

  28. Tim Newman – “For breaching the Mann Act, in his case transporting a prostitute across state lines.”

    For a lot of things actually. He did jail time for armed robbery and tax evasion as well. But not a prostitute. He was convicted and jailed under the Mann Act for taking the 14 year old Janice Escalante, an Apache Indian groupie, on tour with the band. While, I should point out, awaiting trial for another violation of the Mann Act with another girl. You have to admire the guy.

    http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/chuck-berry-goes-on-trial-for-the-second-time

    Tim Newman – “To be fair, that was James Brown.”

    Shame! You got to keep your Rock and Roll Hall of Famers straight. James Brown – domestic violence and PCP. Chuck Berry – one very disturbed guitarist.

    Ian B – “…which brings us back to Feminism, and their entirely invented “White Slave Panic” which was the motivation for this law. Now back again as “Sex Trafficking” of course.”

    Although they do get credit for respecting the Constitution. You had to take her across a State line and hence trigger the inter-state commerce clause. No bullsh!t about how leaving your own corn standing in your own field brought you into the Fed’s orbit.

  29. DBC Reed – “The Mann Act was so badly framed by the usual slack jawed All American morons that you could be convicted for having sex with your girlfriend if you did it in the next state.”

    That does not mean it was badly framed. The Mann Act was partly a response to Feminist hysteria as Ian B pointed out, but it was also a response to the invention of the motor car and hence the freedom of boys and girls to go for a drive and a quick shag. That was partly its intent.

    “The girl was sometimes also convicted; having driven the car could seal a girl’s fate.”

    The Mann Act did not apply to the transportation of boys across state lines. So as usually you are full of sh!t.

    “They charged Charlie Chaplin ( a bit of Commie don’t you know/ no respect for unearned wealth);”

    Who these days would be talking to Yewtree.

    DBC Reed – “BTW I don’t think Phil Spector got any justice either.”

    Yeah, a disturbed man with a history of violence points a gun at a girlfriend’s head, after he has tied her up, and it just goes off by itself. He is completely innocent. You are such a tool.

    “The Yanks go after anybody who acts consciously superior in some respect (which applies to Chaplin, Lloyd Wright, Chuck Berry, Jack Johnson, and Spector)”

    Democracy in action. You know who else they go after? People who break the law.

  30. Tim N-

    No bullsh!t about how leaving your own corn standing in your own field brought you into the Fed’s orbit.

    They didn’t think that one up until the 1930s.

  31. SMfs
    Some classics above:
    The Mann Act was well framed because you’ve decided its true intent was to gaol kids for sex in cars:

    women were never prosecuted under the Mann Act,(they were );

    Chaplin would have been subject to retrospective justice by Yewtree (when the age of consent was vanishingly low in some American States);

    Lana Clarkson was tied up and shot,(she was not tied up.
    It cannot be proved that she was murdered BEYOND REASONABLE DOUBT especially with respect to the forensics evidence);

    The Americans go after people who are a bit more talented than they are AND they also go after people who break the law.
    So that’s alright then! You can gaol just about anybody you feel like, but not the corporations who do not have a legal identity ,according to Tim Worstall.( Come to think of it, he seems a bit talented and disturbed .Lock him up!)

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