Here’s the problem

At this potentially disastrous moment in our history, it is time for Corbyn and McDonnell to move on – indeed, from some of his public remarks, I deduce that McDonnell is more prepared to move against the whole idea of Brexit than Corbyn.

The point is that Labour has captured the imagination, and support, of the young who, unless the whole idea of Brexit is rescinded, will have to suffer the consequences of their elders’ vote to make the country poorer.

They both know very well that their plans for a magic money tree driven Venezuelan fantasy cannot be done while members of the EU. And I would rather expect William Keegan to know this.

12 comments on “Here’s the problem

  1. People who commend Corbyn on not changing his mind on anything in 30 years seem confused that he and his mate might not have changed their minds on the EU……

    The contorsions of the Grauniad set to try and square this circle are delicious.

  2. Yes it would be a shrewd plan for Corbog & McNasty to dismiss all the My-Dad-voted-Labour Brexit supporters who played a major role in his non-victory and join the middle class young free-loader slugs.

    After all the fact that nobody has yet been able measure how much young ZaNu-sucking sewage there is out there is a mere detail.

    And the fact that any youth dissent –apart from mere hormonal horseshit–has been fostered by the negative economic results of statism in general and socialism in particular is also a mere detail. That both main parties love those destructive ideologies and are determined to pursue them in or out of the EU is also another mere detail which the young and dumb will not stop to consider.

  3. At a friend’s wedding celebration on a remote Swedish island last weekend, I kept being approached by baffled Swedes. Their recurring refrain was: why is your country doing this?

    Nation that’s busily abolishing itself can’t understand why other countries want to live. Film at 10.

    It is patently obvious that in this crisis, the 27 are fielding premier-league negotiators, whereas we have less gifted amateurs such as Boris Johnson telling them to “go whistle”.

    It’s just obvious, innit? When you think of the EU, with its professional banana-straighteners, fantasy world foreign policy, and finances that are crookeder than a Jesuit’s conscience, you think professionalism.

    Foot’s pseudonymous successor regards the Brexiters as the modern version of the appeasers

    Bastard appeasers! Appeasing the damn, good for nothing, tyrannical… British electorate.

    At this potentially disastrous moment in our history, it is time for Corbyn and McDonnell to move on

    Because it’s not dishonestly stitching up your supporters if you call it “moving on”.

    The point is that Labour has captured the imagination, and support, of the young who, unless the whole idea of Brexit is rescinded, will have to suffer the consequences of their elders’ vote to make the country poorer.

    Dunno.

    Firstly, there’s a good reason why no society has ever venerated the wisdom and level-headedness of Clearasil customers.

    Second, it’s quite possible our political leadership will find a way to somehow make us poorer as a result of no longer being locked into the moribund EU. But at least we’ll have a country.

    Undoubtedly the decision to wage war on Nazi Germany made us poorer as well. If we’d surrendered after Dunkirk we’d have saved a lot of money. For some reason, our grandfather’s decided they’d rather defend their children’s birthright of a free and sovereign country of their own.

    But that’s “appeaser” talk in the wild and wacky Bizarro world of Euphilia.

    You know what’s definitely going to make us poorer, though? The Paris Agreement, which is a monstrous scam to enrich bankers, strip our industries, and pay the Chinese to burn coal. So why don’t we get out of that mess too?

  4. Undoubtedly the decision to wage war on Nazi Germany made us poorer as well. If we’d surrendered after Dunkirk we’d have saved a lot of money.

    Oh, very good. Very good indeed.

  5. @TIS

    “You know what’s definitely going to make us poorer, though”…

    You could name 101 examples here of left or right wing policies that would fairly clearly make the country poorer (for a conservative example, economists generally dislike immigration caps – and academic economists in especially dislike overseas students paying the big bucks from being included in the cap). Most proponents of these policies will, when push comes to shove, admit that the policy makes us poorer at least in the short/medium term (though they may claim their pet projects would ultimately make us better-off in the long term) but that some things are more important than money. Especially things that they like! However, when one of their opponents suggests a policy that may make us poorer, they immediately revert to claiming money is a clincher again.

    I think it would be more honest if we actually had a Let’s Get Richer Party, devoted entirely to making us better off, nihilistic on the point of view that abstract values, principles and concepts might be more important than money. But I wonder where it might sit in the political spectrum – somewhere near the German Free Democrats maybe? Certainly not particularly similar to the major British parties.

  6. abacab:

    People who commend Corbyn on not changing his mind on anything in 30 years seem confused that he and his mate might not have changed their minds on the EU……

    The contorsions of the Grauniad set to try and square this circle are delicious.

    The way I see it is that the Guardian et al aren’t pro-EU per se they just pretend to be because the see the EU as some bulwark against Anglo-Saxon free markets etc. With JC and his mob in power they’d be happy to be rid of the EU so they could go full retard.

  7. I have a worrying vision that after leaving the EU, Corbyn and his cronies will get into government, ruin the economy, and everybody will shout “see: leaving the EU is a disaster!”

  8. Keegan is one of the most ignorant, pompous and arrogant know nothings writing for the Guardian. Considering the competition, that’s pretty impressive.

  9. How anyone in Sweden could be asking “why is your country doing this” whilst turning there own country into a third world hellhole needs to seriously take a look at themselves. As for Keegan – one of his arguments is that Kinnock turned from being an anti european to a rabid remainer – nothing to do with kinnock and family riding the eu gravy train ???. No mention of democracy at all in keegans diatribe – we dumb brexiteers are too stupid to have the vote anyway. Some years ago Keegan used to talk sense – now i suspect he’s gone senile.

  10. There was a lot of squawking last week from the usual suspects about our supplying arms to KSA so they could bomb Yemenis. It was pointed out that arms manufacture keeps people in gainful employment and makes money for the country (that can be frittered away on the NHS). But the GrauniBeeb insist that money is irrelevant, it’s wrong in principle to sell arms (unless we can be certain they’ll never be used, apparently).

    Yet when it comes to Brexit that has (I think all would agree) some possibility of making us very slightly less rich (at least in the short term), we must jettison democratic decisions immediately with no questions asked. It’s enough to make you scratch your head, innit?

  11. SE – Thank you.

    MBE – Yes, there are trade offs in public policy, honest disagreements, unknowns, disparate impacts, unforeseen consequences and so on.

    Brexit can be framed as an economic leap in the dark, similarly staying in the EU could also have been described that way. No real way of knowing exactly how either option would turn out.

    Paris isn’t like “normal” policy instruments because it’s specifically designed to make us poorer. Not just in the short term, but permanently.

    That is its intent. To decarbonise (i.e. deindustrialise) the West and lower the living standards of the masses. It’s a Morgenthau Plan writ large.

    The only winners are big polluting Third World countries, who will happily take our money and jobs, bankers – who will own us after we get even deeper into debt to buy useless windmills and solar panels (made in China), and the UN, which will take its share of the loot.

    There’s literally no upside to normal people in any of this. There is absolutely no reason to believe the likes of China – which is planning to build more new coal-fuelled power plants than exist in the entire United States – will ever do more than take our money and laugh at us.

    Even if every country signed up to the agreement did what it promised – which they won’t – by the end of this century we’ll have wasted trillions and impoverished the lives of billions of people to reduce global temperatures by the equivalent of a statistical rounding error. Not a single baby polar bear or endangered iceberg is going to be saved by this historic bonfire of money.

    The Paris Accords are an economic suicide note for Western nations, signed by the malicious and the gullible in our name without ever giving us a vote on the matter.

    The only chink of light in this black hole of stupidity and greed is that President Trump pulled the United States out of it. Despite the G-whatever then claiming Paris was “irreversible” (before the US withdrew it was supposedly “voluntary”) it’s likely this particular scam will fall apart without American cash. Turkey is already rumbling that *somebody* better send them truckloads of money so as to (ahem) save the planet. Looks like the Yanks may have just saved ungrateful Europeans from self-immolation yet again.

    The possible financial downside of Brexit is a mere bagatelle compared with the known costs of the Paris Agreement. But as Chris points out, it’s strange how selective the Left’s desire to defend the public purse – not to mention its pretend concern over the future of our younger generations – actually is.

  12. Moqifen,

    It’s also worth noting that Kinnock et in the Labour Party only became Europhiles as Maggie became a sceptic, it was not a principled move. Then they jumped on the gravy train.

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