No

Britain could be forced to end daylight saving time by the European Union after Brexit, a Lords committee has warned.

The European Commission is planning to end the changing of the clocks a month after Brexit in April 2019, during the transition period.

It has raised concerns that daylight savings time is disrupting people’s sleep, damaging their health, and inhibiting productivity at work.

It comes as Britain is set to change the clocks back next Sunday, which could be the last time under the EU’s plans.

The EU might decide to stop doing it, sure. We’ll be free to follow suit or not. And we’d be damn fools not to. The costs of being out of step being far greater than any savings by the doing. In such matters coordination being more important than the thing itself.

51 comments on “No

  1. “It has raised concerns that daylight savings time is disrupting people’s sleep, damaging their health, and inhibiting productivity at work.”

    And just how is it supposedly doing any of these things?

  2. In Australia New South Wales has daylight saving, but Queensland doesn’t so Tweed Heads on the border has two timezones for part of the year.

  3. And we’d be damn fools not to. The costs of being out of step being far greater than any savings by the doing.

    By an hour! Nonsense. We’ve all managed the existing hour difference with Europe, there is no lost productivity (in any measurable sense).

    For the UK, I would suggest that daylight in the morning gets people up and being productive. Which is unnecessary come the longer days of spring where we can adjust to take advantage of more light in the evening as well. What we have simply works.

  4. We used to do it on different weekends, now that really was confusing for a couple f weeks a year.

  5. We could just get used to getting up an hour “earlier”, and not bother with the switch in summer. Staying on summer time all year is ridiculous. Time is just a number after all.

    Norwegians seem to start the day stupidly early so that they have at least some light in their free time.

  6. There’s a good business case for the UK adopting the same time zone as the Continent. I can’t, with certainty, attend a 10:00 meeting in Paris or Frankfurt* unless I travel the night before, incurring unnecessary hotel costs and disrupting my life. The only thing stopping such a sensible course of action seems to be a few crofters in the Hebrides whose sheep will have to wake up an hour earlier (or something).

    * Mind you, much the same is true of English locations that involve a journey round the M25

  7. Fuck ’em.

    The point of leaving is to be free of their dictat. Did the cunts ask anybody, apart from their business cronies of course, if the actual people of Europe wanted their fucking uniform time zone? Why should they? They don’t give a shit what the little people want. Just touch your forelock, speak when you are spoken to and keep handing over the cash. Ever more cash as it happens.

    As for the time itself–we had all that shite 50 years ago–the state tried it and people didn’t like it –kids traveling to school in the dark being a major issue. Perhaps they all go in the car nowadays. It was rescinded and that should be that.

    But the country had a far higher percentage of decent folk then–rather than the crawling, marx-sucking shite who seem to fill it up today.

  8. Chris Miller: There are damn few places in the UK I can get to a 10.00 am meeting without travelling the night before. My hourly rates make a UK hotel stay a minor expense, let alone continental ones that tend to be cheaper, and I add expenses to my invoices.
    Travelling the night before pretty much guarantees you get to the meeting. And there’s always Skype.
    If by disruption of your home life you mean not watching Eastenders, or not having a shag, then tough! There’s ‘catch-up’ TV, or doing it before you set off. It works!

  9. We’ll be free to follow suit or not.”

    You moving back to the UK post Brexit, Tim?

    I’m happy enough to lose clock changing, so long as we stay on BST. I don’t fancy losing summer quality time for “productivity”.

  10. I’m with BiG on this. Just get up an hour earlier if you want the light. It’s farmers that kick up a stink about changing it and it’s not like they have to be in the office at 8am. They can just shoot someone’s pet dog at 6am instead of 7am.

  11. I’ve no idea where I stand on this, but I do suspect we’ll have a nice mini-Y2K if the EU don’t give enough notice of the change.

  12. Tim, reading your Contins article, one could be forgiven for thinking that you were unaware we were already an hour different. btw, aren’t you in Portugal? Is it being different from Spain that’s causing grief…

    Chris Miller, what Excavator Man said. Even a 9 am in Leeds (from the south) and I’ll head up the night before – it’s just a whole lot more productive. Small meetings (ie, useful) tend to organise around those attending in any case. Larger meetings are always compromises.

    And what one loses going across the water one gains coming back. And all vice versa for the furriners doing it the other way.

  13. I haven’t yet found a scheme that alters the amount of daylight we get.

    Any plan to match with one time zone usually means moving away from another.

    So, given no real advantage to be found, my inclination is, whatever the EU wants, we ought not do it.

  14. The EU abolishing DST will not be popular in Sco’land. How will the demented europhiliacs in the SNP cope?

  15. ‘The European Commission is planning to end the changing of the clocks a month after Brexit in April 2019, during the transition period.’

    So we have an actual date certain for Brexit?

  16. Maybe I’m missing something but are there not two questions, first do we stop buggering about with the clocks and second what time zone do we choose if the answer to the first question is yes? I don’t mind stopping the clock change if we get to stay on GMT+1 (BST) all year round, but losing an hour of nice summer evening so it’s light at 3:45 am (if we chose GMT all year) seems ridiculous.

    Is it just me or does phrasing it as “ending daylight saving time” imply moving to GMT all year?

  17. @Excavator Man
    Spending free time with my family is quite important to me. Sorry to learn your own home life is so unsatisfactory.

  18. The EU abolishing DST will not be popular in Sco’land. How will the demented europhiliacs in the SNP cope?

    Blame England.

  19. The system is fine as it is. We get long, lovely evenings in Summer and we avoid the shitty ‘still dark at 9am’ mornings.

    The EU is free to do whatever it wants to themselves, I don’t care.

  20. Those pro-EU Scots will be very, very upset with the EU proposal. Or at least, they always howled when the English mooted abolition of DST. Perhaps it’s good when their dearly beloved EU, source of lots of lovely grants and freebies and ecconomic aid, says it’s to be abolished.

  21. The US manages with 5 time zones

    Why can’t Europe cope? How can it manage its relationship with major trading partners like the US, China and Japan which are all, shockingly, in different time zones?

    I once was on a project with participants in the UK, east and west coast of the USA.We managed meetings etc, all you need is some simple maths – or buy a cheap couple of clocks

    GMT is local time here, we haven’t needed BST for decades, I hear rumours of electric lighting and other new-fangled devices like VTC and telephones

    If getting kids to/from school in the dark is an issue why not change the time of school – or is that too radical a concept?

  22. Chris Miller,

    Dunno where you live, mate, or what you do for a living, but getting anywhere for 10 am for me means not seeing the family in the morning, and unless it’s a really short meeting, or close to home, it means probably not seeing them that evening either.

    I rely on PF for support. I never said you didn’t value your homelife, whatever it is. Don’t use straw men (or straw families). Perhaps you should work from home, or less than 50m away, like I do. Then you’ll see enough of them! You’ll always see enough of them when they want summat, money for instance.

    Anyway, here’s the nice bit: after Brexit, you won’t need to go to those awful places for 10 am meetings, will you?

  23. @Excavator
    Since you sound like a thoroughly nasty and stupid specimen of humanity, I’ve no desire to be your ‘mate’. I’m sure you’re grateful for that.

    The thread is about the unnecessary time difference between us and Europe, not the difficulty of getting to Leeds (or wherever) for a 9am start. FWIW I’m confident that Brexit will cause no diminution in my activities across Europe.

  24. Sadly, all too many have misunderstood me here. It’s not about time differences at all. It’s about variability of time changes. The UK, Ireland, Portugal, being in one time zone, France, Italy in another, that’s fine, just east and west. UIt’s the idea that for some period of the year we’re an hour different, others none, or even two, it’s that variability of time difference which is the problem.

  25. @Tim W

    “others none, or even two, it’s that variability of time difference which is the problem.”

    You’ve turned into a Remoaner – “the people are too stupid to understand different times”

  26. First let me say that ending DST is a good thing – its an idiotic conceit by government thinking that it can organize society on a large scale. If you need the extra hour (or more) of sunlight in the morning – get yourself up an hour earlier.

    “It has raised concerns that daylight savings time is disrupting people’s sleep, damaging their health, and inhibiting productivity at work.”

    Seriously? These people know they are petitioning the government? The same government that swore that DST would increase productivity and safety? If the government got it that wrong, why wait? Why not just ignore DST yourself.

    And why would the UK *after Brexit* be ‘forced’ to end DST? Is it because they think people won’t be able to handle being an hour off of France for half the year? I live in Arizona, we don’t do DST. CA, CO, and Mexico do. Half the year we have the same time as CA (in the next timezone over) and are out of step with CO and Mexico (in our timezone). We’ve managed it and we’re rural rubes, not sophisticated European elites.

  27. Dusty Miller,

    And you are a twat – the other guy has a sense of humour, and you don’t! Loosen up.

  28. First let me say that ending DST is a good thing – its an idiotic conceit by government thinking that it can organize society on a large scale. If you need the extra hour (or more) of sunlight in the morning – get yourself up an hour earlier.

    Make your mind up!

    We’ve managed it and we’re rural rubes, not sophisticated European elites.

    Agreed. I mean of course the “reading a clock is easy” bit….

  29. Having solved all other pressing problems, Britain and the EU argue over how to set the clock.

  30. I hope the UK goes to UTC all year round. It makes the time difference between here and there six hours instead of seven in the summer (no summer time here as we’re too close to the equator).

  31. I’d go for clocks going foward permantly by 2 hours for the whole year. I want the late, light nights. Fuck the rest of it, I’ll be retired with a bit luck and wont care tuppence about being able to get to the EU for a business meeting.

  32. My heart bleeds for you lot and your 10am meetings.

    I frequently have cause to be dragged to some random spot or other in the country for 7 or 8 am. I’ve discovered a marvelous device to enable this, namely an alarm clock. Subtract driving time (say 3 hours) from desired arrival time (say 8am). Conclude one needs to set off a 5am. Subtract another 15 mins for dragging clothes on, taking a leak, defrosting the car. Set alarm for 4.45am. Go to bed a couple of hours early.

    The additional advantage of this approach is usually there is no traffic at 5am and one can get a long way on an empty motorway really quite quickly. Living fairly in the middle of England helps too – I’m less than 3 hours from the Scottish Border, or the M25.

  33. Before the EU made us align in 1995 there were a couple of weeks a year where we were 0 out 2 hours difference. That was back in the days of paper airline timetables, so commuting was a nightmare.

    We should go back to that – flaunt our sovereignty. As well as pounds and ounces.

  34. I’m with @Daedalus – fuck getting up earlier. Love the long evenings. And double fuck the EU – we can whatever fucking hours we like.

  35. Pf,

    Since we are all walting about our meetings I will join in on the gained and lost hour for crossing the water. From Germany I can attend a 9 am to 5pm all day meeting and sleep in my own bed the night before and after. You cannot do that from London to Germany because the morning time difference works against you.

  36. Because a 7am flight to London gets me to London at 7:30. A 7am flight from London to BiGcity gets you there about 9:30.

  37. Hang on. I’m in Singapore right now, which doesn’t have summer time given it’s 100 miles from the equator and days vary in length by a whole 7-8 mins.

    How the hell do they manage to coordinate with everyone who has DST or some variation? Answer is they use computers which seem to know these things when it comes to scheduling. Modern life. Isn’t it great?

  38. Singapore’s time zone is an odd one because it’s an hour ahead of what it ‘should’ be. Apparently Malaysia decided to standardize their time with the Eastern part of the country (although almost everyone lives on the peninsular) and Singapore followed suit. I remember staying in Singapore and having a meeting on Batam island, which belongs to Indonesia, and is an hour different alough only just off the coast (there’s some free trade agreement where Batam is part of a SEZ with Singapore).

  39. PF:

    We’ve all managed the existing hour difference with Europe, there is no lost productivity (in any measurable sense).

    And in fact the Azores is -1, whereas mainland Portugal is 0. The Canary Islands are at UTC, whereas the rest of Spain is an hour ahead, as is Gibraltar.

  40. rhoda klapp:

    So, given no real advantage to be found, my inclination is, whatever the EU wants, we ought not do it.

    Is there any real need for the GDPR? Is it purely something the EU wants, and why are we having it in our law post-Brexit? I’m an idiot that has been dutifully ignoring any of the press coverage about it – do we need it? I need to be spoonfed hummus like a two-year-old. The EU wants it – but why?

  41. One very good reason to repeal GDPR would be getting rid of those fucking annoying consent forms every time you look at a new site (or clear out your cookies as anyone that cares about online security should do regularly).

  42. Other point is that the GDPR reminds me of the LDPR, you know, those insane Russian ultranationalist fascists that come out with some notoriously choice comments.

  43. @theProle
    We can’t do much about 7am starts, if that’s what the job requires. We can’t do a huge amount about the time it takes to get to the other end of the country (or even Leeds). But you can’t make even a 10am start in Europe, because we’re an hour behind (as BiGiJ pointed out) and that’s something we could easily fix – and it would bring other benefits, too as Daedalus says.

    I don’t agree with our esteemed host that the only important thing is to synchronise DST changes – we don’t with the US and it doesn’t cause huge problems, but of course no-one is nipping over to Boston for a day’s work.

  44. Local time all year round as nature intended, GMT and Railway Time if you must. Want to do business east of the channel? Get up an hour earlier. If there is a demand I am sure some airline will provide.

  45. @djc
    I’m sure some airlines would like to meet the demand. But airports are closed while people are sleeping – which is generally based on local time. Heathrow is limited to 16 aircraft movements a night between 23:30 and 06:00, and there are no scheduled departures.

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