16 comments on “Interesting

  1. “Of course there’s a world of difference between the populism of the left and the right, which is what we’re seeing in Brazil, Hungary, the US and the endless chaos of Brexit. What’s so appalling is the outcome is often the same: the slippery slope to authoritarianism, corruption and abject poverty. ”

    Er…reality check here? Exactly where has this been true? US seems to be on an economic upswing since Trump. Brexit hasn’t happened yet & if the UK economy’s been faltering since the referendum result it’s because Remainers in Parliament have thrown what could have been an orderly process into chaos. Likewise, Brasil’s populist lurch to the right is about 3 weeks old. Is Hungary’s economy tanking? On an historical note. One could definitely regard Poland’s Solidarity movement as populism. As was the general collapse of communism in the Eastern Bloc. Poland, Chech Republic, Slovakia, Romania, Hungary. All worse off after a populist move to the right?
    Corruption? The left have pretty well defined political corruption in office. Why Lula got booted out in Brasil. Chavez’ wife’s billions? The Castro family hoard? The Clinton Foundation.
    Guardian seems to have its own facts.

  2. BiS – the slippery slope to authoritarianism, corruption and abject poverty

    Because the respectable Clownworld alternative:

    * Unlimited immigration of low-IQ welfare parasites (and their highly extended, highly retarded families)

    * The middle class being taxed-n-spent into oblivion

    * Having access to electricity and personal transportation turned into luxuries by green energy policies

    will make us all rich, I tells thee!

    Just ask those folks in Leicester.

  3. Presumably Chavez realised that leaving billions in his will might look a bit off to his socialist cheerleaders, so “spent” vast amounts in “election expenses” by “purchasing” services from family members and trusted cronies.

  4. Think you miss the point, Steve. I’m trying to think of a single “populist” move rightward that resulted in a “slippery slope to authoritarianism, corruption and abject poverty” & failing to come up with any in my lifetime. One could possibly call Franco or Salazar “populist” right. They’d certainly score on the authoritarianism, but I don’t get the impression either Spain or Portugal were either particularly uncorrupted or prosperously equal before their ascendancy. And that was a long time ago
    That leftist “populist” movements seem inevitably to end up on a “slippery slope to authoritarianism, corruption and abject poverty” seems to be a built in feature. But the right wing corollary appears absent. Indeed, as you say. Only in Guardian clownworld.

  5. @Steve January 18, 2019 at 5:36 pm

    * Unlimited immigration of those from corrupt cultures:

    Seven benefits assessors who pocketed more than £1million by submitting false housing claims and diverting the money to their own accounts are convicted of fraud Guess melanin

  6. BiS – Sure. (I am also skeptical of the utility of defining the political spectrum in terms of opposing poles of “right” and “left” in Current Year, but we’re probably stuck with it till nationalist v globalist catches on more).

    As for authoritarianism, well – look at how the French police are shooting protesters (and compare, contrast with how they stand by and let Arabs and Africans torch the banlieues every year).

    I reckon the status quo is anarcho-tyranny. We are no longer a society of laws, but a society of petty rules, enforced selectively and maliciously.

    So… excessive jackbooted thuggery for normal people doing normal things the State doesn’t like (Countryside Alliance marchers, people selling bananas by the pound, people fostering kids while being too Christian or too Ukippy), blind-eyes all round for the shenanigans of the State’s imported feral pets and the softest of soft touches when they go on murderous rampages.

    The populist alternative these days is virtually always some sort of libertarian-lite, Thatcherite limited-government law-n-order type of regime, where the police are expected to catch rapists instead of YouTube jokers and tax monies aren’t spent on teaching kids about dildos.

    Franco did nothing wrong (except to be too lenient). Tbf Latin fascism (actual fascism rather than the Guardian definition of “everyone to the Right of Jez”) is pretty much always both a reaction, and a better alternative, to what the socialists had planned. Pinochet’s Chile was a damn sight better than Chavez’s worker’s paradise. Even Mussolini was preferable to Stalinism. Unfortunately German autism and leather shorts fetishery made fascism uncool forever – maybe the dagos are the true master race.

    Pcar – Every damn time. I remember The Cook Report used to uncover an embarrassing preponderance of this sort of thing, before the media decided to self-censor vibrant crime.

  7. Of course there’s a world of difference between the populism of the left and the right

    Of course. How could anyone whose entire worldview is that she is good and her enemies evil possibly think otherwise?

  8. “Of course there’s a world of difference between the populism of the left and the right, which is what we’re seeing in Brazil, Hungary, the US and the endless chaos of Brexit. What’s so appalling is the outcome is often the same: the slippery slope to authoritarianism, corruption and abject poverty. ”

    Given Chile has turned into the most successful state in south america, I call bull shit on the outcomes being the same.

  9. I also note the mandatory dig at Trumpitler who, apparently

    sprang from the small screen and is increasingly called a dictator.

    Really? I thought that Trump was already famous as a rude, narcissistic real estate mogul, and that’s why he got his tv series?

  10. Ironically, Steve, whilst Macron may be arming the Paris police with automatic weapons to stop the gilets jaunes storming the Elysee Palace, you can still buy bananas by the pound in France. Or wine by the pint and, as I discovered, garden sheds measured in feet. Law of 1803, if I remember rightly. Acknowledges that the then newfangled metric system is the official standard for measurement in France. But stipulates that no Frenchman can be prosecuted for using the older, Imperial, measures. Introduced by a right-wing populist named Napoleon Bonaparte.

  11. Steve:

    “The populist alternative these days is virtually always some sort of libertarian-lite, Thatcherite limited-government law-n-order type of regime, where the police are expected to catch rapists instead of YouTube jokers and tax monies aren’t spent on teaching kids about dildos.”

    Hopefully, post-Brexit, that’s what Tories become. It will be ace.

  12. “Hopefully, post-Brexit, that’s what Tories become. It will be ace.”

    Do you still hang your stockings up for Santa? Spreadsheet Phil’s conference calls with his masters in the FT500 tell you where the Tory sympathies lie.

  13. “Guardian seems to have its own facts.”
    when one is ideologically pure, facts don’t matter.

  14. Franco did nothing wrong

    So the terror bombing the civilians of Guernica is “nothing wrong”? The scores at the end of the war were settled with bullets too, and the mass graves are still being found.

    Franco ran a ridiculously authoritarian regime. Teachers had to be Catholic, for example, not any good at teaching. The country was prevented from developing a modern economy because his ridiculous protectionist ideas (which included keeping peasants on the land rather than allowing modern agriculture). It was a stifling and idiotic system and the tensions in it were ready for explosion.

    There were fewer deaths in the later years, because like the Soviets he had the screws down so tight that no-one said “boo”. The bombings and shootings of ETA is largely due to that though, and it took democracy to calm it down by allowing divergent opinion.

    The one thing Franco did right was realise that his system wasn’t working. So he allowed democracy on this death — hardly a ringing endorsement when the ruler himself admits that his ideas were unsuccessful.

    The only way you can have Franco do “nothing wrong” is by refusing to accept that he did anything wrong by willful blindness.

Leave a Reply

Name and email are required. Your email address will not be published.

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.