16 comments on “Just amuses really

  1. https://www.pprune.org/military-aviation/221116-future-carrier-including-costs-274.html#post10473711

    Which says:

    “I believe this a tradition of what is called a reverse brevet.

    His actual rank is Commodore, but as he was filling a Captain’s role he followed the tradition of wearing a Captain’s rank.

    This has the practical effect on ensuring that there would be no confusion in the chain of command if the carrier was part of a flotilla where another officer was breveted as a Commodore in command, and probably accommodated along with his staff on board the carrier.”

    In other words: The Army has “History”, the Royal Navy has Traditions” and the RAF have “Nasty Little Habits”. 🙂

  2. Which is weird because when my father was a Commodore it was a posting, not a substantial rank….

  3. PJH – Ha!

    Funny, I was watching an old interview with Jack Tramiel recently. He had an amazing life – Holocaust survivor turned US Army soldier turned taxi driver turned self-made computer magnate.

    Old Jack was a ruthless bastard in business, and had a great salesman’s eye for products. Commodore was never the same again after he left, and the industry as a whole is poorer for not having big personalities like his in it.

  4. Tim – Wikipedia says (but given that you’re evidently very much younger than we think, it might not be relevant in your Dad’s case):

    “Commodore has only been a substantive rank in the Royal Navy since 1997. Before then it continued to be an appointment conferred on senior captains holding certain positions.”

  5. Oh well.. I was always under the impression a commodore was a seat with a hole in & full a shit. We live & learn

  6. Oh well.. I was always under the impression a commodore was a seat with a hole in & full a shit.

    That’s a humidor.

  7. Do we still have a majority of Admirals over Ships?

    And does that not mean that a Commodore only gets one for his bathtub?

  8. @PJH May 24, 2019 at 10:29 am

    ROFL – The PET was the first “PC” I used & programed: Assembly & Basic

    .
    @Rev. Spooner

    Thanks. Sounds similar to Officers being told what to do by NCOs at Sandhurst

    Rank matters, but obeying boss’s orders matters more.

  9. There was me thinking the spelling mistake was an homage to the campest of camp duos, Julian and Sandy…….ooooh vada the butch ommodore in his fantabulosa uniform!

  10. Rev. Spooner is correct.

    Historically in the Royal Navy a Commodore wasn’t a rank but a temporary appointment. Basically, back in Napoleonic War times, if a small squadron of ships was going off on a mission, it wasn’t enough to justify even a Rear Admiral, but each ship was commanded by a Captain, all of equal rank, and someone had to be put in charge, so one of them was made Commodore for the duration of the mission.

    (if they didn’t, the rule was that the most senior captain was in charge, i.e. the one who had been a captain for longest, but that might be a time-serving old fart)

    They reverted to being captain when the mission ended (and I think they did if any sort of Admiral even appeared over the horizon).

    Captain’s pay I think, but they also got a share in the prize money of all the ships under their temporary command (there are probably other Patrick O’Brian fans here; one of his books covers it in some detail). Wore a Rear Admiral’s uniform while they were Commodore, but that must have been a heavy expense for a temporary appointment.

    The use broadened, but it was still a temporary appointment whilst carrying out a particular function.

    Then, fairly recently, they decided to make it a proper rank. Not sure why; possibly to fill a gap in the NATO rank listing?

    In contrast the Yanks made Commodore an actual rank early on, and did throughout the 19th century. Then in the 20th century they kept changing their minds about it. Currently it is a rank in the Royal Navy (a recent innovation) but is only a temporary or honorary appointment in the US Navy, which is the reverse of the historic position.

    Basically the problem was that the Yanks regarded a Commodore as the lowest flag-officer rank (like a naval equivalent of a 1-star general), but everyone else (particularly us Brits) regarded it as just a senior captain, so we didn’t show Yankee Commodores the respect they thought they deserved, so they scrapped it and made all their Commodores into Rear Admirals.

    But then that pissed off the US Army, because a Rear Admiral is equivalent to a Major General (2-star), so suddenly all these relatively junior Navy 1-star types had become 2-star equivalents, putting the Army’s nose out of joint.

    After changing their minds for a bit, re-instating and then dropping Commodores, they scrapped it but split Rear Admiral into lower (equivalent to a 1-star general) and upper (2-star).

    There have been similar problems with brigadiers (which at one point was also a temporary appointment in the British Army, given to colonels whilst carrying out a particular role) but even when it was permanent there were often international differences as to whether it was regarded as the senior field rank or the most junior staff rank.

    All a bit easier now, I think, because there’s a nice NATO table of equivalent ranks so it doesn’t matter so much what they’re called.

  11. As I (a mere civvy) understand it, our current Brigadiers were originally Brigadier-Generals. Brigadier was a French (~Napoleonic) military rank roughly equivalent to Corporal, so general ranks went Brigadier-General, (Sergeant-)Major-General, Lieutenant-General.

    A good friend has just been made up from Group Captain to Air Commode, so he’s understandably chuffed.

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