35 comments on “Well, yes

  1. Gove blew it. He fucked up last time, but if he’d stuck where he was, as a small government Conservative leaver, he might have a chance. But he voted repeatedly for the WA and has become a plastic straw-banning nanny bastard.

  2. I have a theory that Michael Gove has a hidden brain tumour, thats caused him to have a massive personality change. He used to be a decent low tax small state pro freedom Tory, now he’s a fully paid up member of the nanny state classes. I suggest that such a dramatic change of character can only have been instigated by some exterior force.

  3. That exterior force might be Sarah Vine – and nobody has claimed that she’s non-malignant as far as I can tell.

  4. I too was shocked by the ‘personality change’. I discount the brain tumour and reckon he was always a self-seeking power hungry person who goes where the wind blows. But he was bright enough to hide it!

    He thought his moment had come, shafted Boris and went full on to what he thought would take him to the top.

    I hope I am wrong. And despite the health issue would love Jim to be right.

  5. Now the tories are outed as the Leave Over Our Dead Bodies party I expect May’s replacement to have the same orders, sabotage brexit, and be equally bidable. Gove seems to fit the bill.

  6. The problem the Conservative Party has got is that having made itself the Brexit Party its ability to appeal to the centre ground is gone for decades. That means it has to keep its UKIP vote or die.
    That boxes you into the Le Pen/Farrage cul de sac whereby you get a solid third or more but everyone else just hates you so much they will make any compromise to keep you out

    We are headed for a soft left hegemony ultimately and with a No Deal disaster to fix in the mythology you will find over the next few years that bit by bit we end up pretty much where we were by another name
    This will suit the inter-web contrarians who never actually wanted to be responsible for anything anyway – no?

  7. The tories have no intention of leaving. They’re just saying that because they know that’s what their voters want. They have five months to come up with a leave in name only deal and two and a half years after that to smooth it over. Competent politicians could pull it off, but they’re idiots, so maybe not. The fly in the ointment is that they are keener to stay than the EU is to keep them, so they can’t expect much help there.

  8. So if the Tories get a new leader who says we’re leaving in October come what may, then MPs will force a general election presumably? And then they’ll have to be hard with their Brexit offering in the manifesto to avoid losing votes to the Brexit Party? And then we’ll end up with a Marxist PM?

  9. The ‘Tories need to occupy the centre ground to get elected’ argument is bollocks.

    They’ve been a New Labour tribute band for 20 years and it’s got them nowhere. The only time they’ve been able to form a government without the aid of the LDs or the DUP is in 2015, after Cameron wooed the right with his referendum promise.

  10. “That boxes you into the Le Pen/Farrage cul de sac whereby you get a solid third or more but everyone else just hates you so much they will make any compromise to keep you out”

    Over half the voters voted to leave.

    The problem is that the Conservatives need to realign. See, Brexit is roughly on the lines of parasites vs producers. Meet someone who works in the public sector, they’re remainers. Meet an independent painter and decorator, they’re leave. But so is James Dyson. So are all sorts of people.

    This is the alignment that no-one grasps. You can meet blokes who fit things in car factories who like James Dyson. They don’t care that he’s worth a billion. As far as they’re concerned, he worked hard, took risks, and deserved it. Likewise, the working class don’t really mind rich rock stars and footballers.

    You can pull rich and poor together into a party that has a clear philosophical perspective: some redistribution from richest to poorest, but shrink the size of government.

    It’s going to take someone with an iron will. Someone who is going to pretty much go to war on the One Nation wing of the Conservatives, drive them out, and welcome in the sort of people who are BP supporters.

  11. “The problem the Conservative Party has got is that having made itself the Brexit Party…”

    But we don’t count its votes as “leave” in our fantasy euro league because reasons.

    Remain won, see! La la la la la.

  12. Its hard to see the Tories surviving a GE this side of Brexit. Perhaps they could throw the dice and go early before Farage can get organised, but that’s a big gamble.

    The only way I can see is to force Parliament to vote against No Deal (or get a “good deal, unlikely as that sounds) and then force a GE. At least they’ll be able to say in all honesty it was the other parties that forced it, but that also relies on 100% from their own MPs.

  13. A decent Brexit is the Tories only shot at survival. Cowing their shite remainiac MPs is the first requirement of any new leader. Easy enough to do –IF you have any balls–even those of a gnat will do.

    I don’t see one among the pack of cowards they have.

  14. It doesn’t really matter what Parliament, MP’s or the parties decide: we are going to leave the EU, but not through any action of theirs.

    Article 50 does not allow continuous extensions unless it is for specific negotiations. The French, in particular, and others, have had enough and – per the French Europe Minister today – will veto any extension after 31st October.

    Well, that’s my prediction and it doesn’t have to win a vote in Parliament to come about!

  15. That exterior force might be Sarah Vine – and nobody has claimed that she’s non-malignant as far as I can tell.

    Just about every bloke I know who has bought into the environmentalism cult or organic food scam has done so because of his wife.

  16. “Just about every bloke I know who has bought into the environmentalism cult or organic food scam has done so because of his wife.”

    The feelz – otherwise known as the death of masculinity.

  17. Recusant: Good point. I can’t see ‘revoke A50’ getting enough support, and I wonder if Parliament could force that anyway. As it’s Treaty stuff then it’s in the purview of the Sovereign (in reality the PM), though the Gina Miller fiasco does muddy the waters now.

    However I can’t discount the EU granting extensions if the prospect of us recanting becomes real enough for them.

  18. Very Mitt Romneyesque.

    Within a week the Tories will have more MPs fighting to lead the party than the party has voters.

    Much ado about a corpse.

  19. The feelz – otherwise known as the death of masculinity.

    Maybe, but doubtful… it’s hard to deny that pussy and the odd bit of brain salad surgery is often a very strong motivator for the male of the species. That and having the feminine noise level reduced in the house.

    Securing more sex and less chattering are masculine impulses.

  20. This is not a Tory leadership contest, it is an undertaker contest and the sod picked will have to bury the corpse.

  21. “Maybe, but doubtful… it’s hard to deny that pussy and the odd bit of brain salad surgery is often a very strong motivator for the male of the species. That and having the feminine noise level reduced in the house.”

    Why are girls into crystal healing shops and homeopathy so pretty? Because men prioritise fucking pretty women over the downer that double-blind trials disprove them.

  22. If he said

    ‘I believe I can unite this country in disunity’

    I’d believe him, not otherwise.

  23. @BoM4

    One of my tutorial supervisors at Cambridge was a strikingly pretty, young female academic – also extremely sharp intellectually and a lass on the up, had got a professorship very young and was already running a Centre within her Department (one that she was the driving force for the creation of, iirc). She was also more than a little bit weird, as very bright folk often are.

    Something my brain has never really got itself around, though, is why she was in to the whole “power of crystals” thing. Which were dotted all round her office she took supervisions in. Had nobody taken the time to explain to her that it was all nonsense, or did she just not listen or understand? To be fair, it’s possible she just thought they were pretty and kinda cool in an off-beat way.

    Now I never saw a chap like that, though I wonder whether there is some male woo equivalent.

  24. There were quite probably world-eminent scientists just a couple of doors down that college corridor, who could have delivered the lecture series on x-ray crystallography and failed to comprehend the not-even-wrongness of the whole crystal power thing. Weird to think of really.

    (In case anyone is tempted to do the whole Oxbridge hell-in-a-handcart thing, it was one of those newfangled 1970s colleges, not one of the “proper” ones. Then again, not sure whether my own college was really a “proper” one either…)

  25. I just don’t understand the Conservative Party. Brexit is a natural policy for them, and it fucks Labour because it exposes them as the Metropolitan middle class internationalist wankers they now are. The Tories could win seats in northern cities – they used to, they can again.

    Instead they want to keep the Guardian and the BBC happy. It’s inconprehensible.

  26. Lord Ashcroft’s polling indicates that the most electorally popular new party would be one which aimed to reduce immigration, took a tougher line on law and order, slashed the international aid budget, cut most ties to the EU after Brexit, and believed that the threat of climate change is exaggerated.

    That’s the good news. The bad news is that it would attract only 27% of voters. That’s a start, of course. But to get the numbers up would apparently require more left of centre economics.

    Crudely, the centre of UK politics is right wing on social issues and left wing on economics.

  27. If a real and meaningful Brexit has not happened by the time that the next general election occurs, and the Conservatives stand on a commitment to actually deliver one, who on earth would believe them?

  28. Could any Conservative even think of a way to get leave-inclined Labour MPs to vote for Brexit?

    I suppose a real toughie could use MI5 and the Police to frighten some of the Conservative Remainers to vote Leave but I’d hate to see our politics descend into that sort of stuff.

    A compromise: how about using MI5 files to persuade some Labour people to vote Leave? Corvid for a start.

  29. Mr on M4 another +1

    and another for May 28, 2019 at 11:30 am

    btw I grasped that decades ago – I call it Freedom vs State Totalitarianism

    .
    @Recusant May 28, 2019 at 12:18 pm

    I believe UK payments vs No extension 31 October will be won by UK payments.

    Then Brexit and rest of anti-EU MEPs will cause such havoc we’ll be refused another

    .
    @Rob May 28, 2019 at 5:27 pm

    +1

  30. Theophrastus

    “Crudely, the centre of UK politics is right wing on social issues and left wing on economics”

    You mean like the Soviet Union?

  31. Instead they want to keep the Guardian and the BBC happy. It’s incomprehensible.

    That is because they too are Metropolitan middle class internationalist wankers. They hate the Tory core vote (or former core vote) just as much as they hate working class Northerners.

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