Just a thought, but who is subject to the sexism here?

Over the years, I have heard too many tales of female employees subjected to gross levels of sexism (hired for their looks,

Women who get a good job – look, they must think it’s a good one or they wouldn’t have applied for it, would they – because of their looks are subject to sexism? Or women who don’t get the job because of their not job getting looks? Or men who only get a job because they can do something?

Who, actually, is it that is the victim of this sexism?

One way to test this is to ponder, well, what if there were compensation for being a victim of sexism? OK, so “You’re pretty, you got a good job because you are, here, have some extra money.”

That work?

40 comments on “Just a thought, but who is subject to the sexism here?

  1. Over the years, I have heard too many tales of female employees subjected to gross levels of sexism

    Well, Guardian writer, a social and ‘professional’ circle comprised entirely of people who think exactly the same way as them, I wouldn’t have expected anything else.

  2. No matter what your advantages in life, love – and the quest for it – is a great leveller. Yet until women, the LGBT+ community and people of colour start to radically reshape the dating app industry, it will remain the least desirable place to find it.

    I don’t think it is a particularly great place for vanilla peeps to find love either. Oh, and the Gs & Bs have their own dating apps already (and the L’s have the Cat Protection League?)

  3. Have never hired a woman based on her looks.
    In my experience the ones who think they are good looking are high maintenance. Better to hire based on the rest of the application including interview answers.

    If they are also good eye candy that is not an issue. Scoring indicates why hired. Or not hired.

  4. No point in going out of your way to hire attractive women unless you anticipate gaining some sexual benefit from them. Otherwise you are just surrounding yourself with potential benefits that are not going to be potentiated. Esp not in today’s marx-fem puke-world where looking at them wrong equals lawsuits.

  5. No point in going out of your way to hire attractive women unless you anticipate gaining some sexual benefit from them.

    Yeah, but my dad’s old adage of “Don’t shit where you eat” still applies. More so in this politically correct age where even the accusation of “being a bit creepy” is enough to get most white males handed a P45 / Pink Slip.

    Quite frankly the risks of employing the flighty snowflakes who pretend to be women (but are actually little more than indulgent children) are so great that I’m surprised small firms still employ them.

    Clearly I am a hateful, right-wing, misogynist Nazi…

  6. There can be a principle/agent problem here.

    I wouldn’t hire a woman on looks. Better to hire a woman who knows her job and you don’t want to fuck and spend the profits on whores.

    But what if it’s not your money? I knew a manager who surrounded himself with eye candy. There was never any suggestion he shagged any of them. I think he just liked better scenery to work in.

  7. Some women are also hired for their looks because it actually matters. Sales, in particular. Lots of hot recruitment consultants in IT. Why? Because developers would rather be taken out for drinks by a hot girly than some wide boy in a BMW, and everything else is equal.

  8. too many similarly sized dating apps share a toxic working culture where the safety, dignity and respect due to both dating app employees and their users comes at the cost of a million gamed profiles – and the profits they rake in for a select group of privileged white male executives.

    White man bad!

    In many ways there is a culture war between some of the male CEOs and the engineers who have confected apps in line with their Weird Science fantasies, and everyone else who works there who are genuinely driven by a impulse to help people find love.

    Imagine thinking that “dating” apps are there to help people find love. This is naivety on par with sad, middle aged men who think strippers are attracted to them.

    I’ve heard stories of black and Asian employees commandeered to be the diverse “faces” of the business while they try to assuage the concerns of BAME users experiencing racism, whether in the form of a complete lack of matches or direct abuse.

    So, “my body, my choice”, but if you don’t want to have sex with brown people you’re raciss.

    At the same time, LGBT+ employees are grilled on the details of their sex and dating lives by hetero-normative execs.

    Shitthatdidn’thappen.txt

    While the often straight, white male developers and CEO and COOs of dating apps make the million-dollar decisions about which user groups to titillate next, the diverse workers who make up everyone else at the companies wrangle with ways to conceal their employer’s prejudices.

    But there’s nothing they can do, because the top-hatted, moustache-twirling evil capitalists control the means of production! Muahahahaa!

    Dating apps have so much potential to help address the endemic racism that affects people’s matching options (as decided by obtuse algorithms).

    Maybe we should all fire into Diane Abbott’s great big bushy snizz to cure our racism.

  9. As Congressman Charlie Wilson was alleged to have said “You can teach them to type, but you can’t teach them to grow tits”.

    Fair enough in a cesspit like Washington DC I guess, but if somebody is employing eye candy instead of workers it seems to me that whoever is responsible for that person is themselves at fault.

    Modern HR practice seems to be an exclusively female profession nowadays, employing the worst sort of feminazi harridans, so I doubt that a stale, pale and male manager hiring eye-candy would go unnoticed or unpunished.

  10. Steve: “So, “my body, my choice”, but if you don’t want to have sex with brown people you’re raciss.”

    Yup, how soon ‘you love who you love’ became ‘you better love who it’s fashionable to love, or else!

  11. Tim yep.

    “users experiencing racism, whether in the form of a complete lack of matches…..”

    A complete lack of matches eh? “Hey mateys, i pay you money, you provide matches,” Ok, but then

    “..by developers who were only concerned with the performance of two things – the rate of click-throughs to the ads and the buoyancy of the shares ”

    Fee Ap ad supported model rules out contractual dispute. (and if there is a contract along data-for-dates lines, they’d have to’ve skimped on lawyers not to have excluded liabilities to people who no-one else wants to shag/love/worship.) So we’ll just call it a social hate crime instead.

  12. While the often straight, white male developers and CEO and COOs of dating apps make the million-dollar decisions about which user groups to titillate next

    The developers are making the million-dollar decisions? Lol, this numpty has absolutely no clue whatsoever.

    Still, those race riots won’t start themselves, you know.

  13. “While the often straight, white male developers and CEO and COOs of dating apps make the million-dollar decisions about which user groups to titillate next, the diverse workers who make up everyone else at the companies wrangle with ways to conceal their employer’s prejudices.”

    You could learn to fucking code. Skip the degrees in psychology or English and do computer science.

    You get to run a well-known dating app by having VC money. You get VC money by building a dating app and getting some customers. Building the dating app needs developers. And developers don’t work for nothing. Which is why the route of so many tech companies is a guy working in his dorm room/neighbours garage.

    None of these feminists ever get this. Hewlett-Packard, Apple, Google, Microsoft, Facebook were all 50%+ nerd at foundation (and while Jobs wasn’t a hardcore nerd, he understood it in some depth).

  14. Julia – Maybe Comrade Corbyn will fix this with a National Sex Service.

    BoM4 – You get to run a well-known dating app by having VC money.

    Despite the success of eBay-for-shagging apps such as TINDER, BLENDR and GRINDR, those heteronormative VC bastards refused to fund my idea for CHEGGR, an app allowing you to hook up with chucklesome Swap Shop star Keith Chegwin.

  15. “those heteronormative VC bastards refused to fund my idea for CHEGGR, an app allowing you to hook up with chucklesome Swap Shop star Keith Chegwin.”

    Probably because he’s dead, so the business opportunities are somewhat limited……………..

  16. “My body my choice.”

    “Yeah, poppet, and my wallet my choice.”

    “You men are so stupid. It doesn’t work like that.”

  17. FFS

    Another day, another whine about how business isn’t be run the way it should be.

    START YOUR OWN FUCKING BUSINESS.

    If you’re right, you’ll make a fortune.

  18. “Who, actually, is it that is the victim of this sexism?”

    The women of course, thats the basic principle – women suffer sexism, regardless of what happens to them.

  19. “Lots of hot recruitment consultants in IT. Why? Because developers would rather be taken out for drinks by a hot girly than some wide boy in a BMW, and everything else is equal.”

    Ahhhh, so that’s why pharma headhunters are all wide-boys with BMWs. Female-dominated industry.

  20. @Steve

    A National Sex Service has actually been suggested in seriousness, in order to fulfil the fulfil the human rights (iirc it was Article 8 that got cited as the reason, the right to a family and private life) of disabled people. But logically I can’t see why it shouldn’t / couldn’t be extended to other people who find it difficult to arrange a sexual partner, at least provided some protected characteristic is at play (might cover “nobody in society wants to date an Asian man” or whatever the complaint is).

  21. Guys! Read the article (OK you probably need a couple of beers or a large brandy first). The girls are hired for their looks, the “diversity” people are hired for their diversity.
    The “victims” of the sexism are straight white men who are discriminated against on the basis of the gender and colour.
    Then some feminists will tell us that it can’t be sexism against men because it isn’t sexism if it discriminates against men (Yes, I have heard this several times).

  22. I was once interviewing for a key position. All the interviewees were female. I noticed that my two female colleagues were filling in their score sheets in pencil. Why? I asked. The reply: so that we can alter the scores if necessary, because the company can’t afford a woman of child-bearing age in this role.

  23. Watson had a go at a women who is undergoing chemotherapy (head of complaints), imagine if someone less woke or leftie had done that

  24. Pcar – What BNIC said.

    But also, re: the Jew thing…

    Does anyone think the Labour Party suddenly became anti-Semitic when Jeremy Corbyn was elected its leader?

    Pull the other one, it’s got an eruv wire attached.

    There’s long been a streak of Jew-baiting in Labour. It goes with the #woke Free Palestine territory, and their Muslim following (85% of Muslims currently residing in Britain support Labour and they’re not generally big fans of Judaism).

    This doesn’t seem to have substantially changed since poor old Ed Milliband was running the place, or the strangely Brown period before him. It just wasn’t mentioned by the media until recently. Twas one of those little leftie foibles the press didn’t think was important for you to know about, like Rotherham.

    Corbyn himself makes for an implausible Julius Streicher. The funny little stache is even less likely to stick than the Tories’ doomed effort to paint him as Lenin 2.0 (Jez is actually just another Metropolitan wanker with a touch of Wolfie Smith about him).

    So why now? Why is the Leader of the Opposition being described as an “existential threat to Jewish life”? Why is the BBC spending so much time and money trying to persuade people that the most important issue in Labourdom is what they think about Neil Diamond?

    There’s fewer Jews in Britain than there are Welsh speakers. There’s probably just as much anti-Catholic sentiment in the Labour Party as there is Synagogueoscepticism (the son of the Manse seemed to take especial delight in rubbing the left footers’ noses in it). So why this issue?

    It’s not about the Jews.

    It’s about the political establishment trying to take back control of the Labour Party. They don’t trust Jez for whatever reason. They wouldn’t let poor Jeremy go to any Bilderberg games. The plan is to smear him into oblivion and install another establishment hack in his place. Someone who can be trusted not to deviate from the agenda.

    Similar things are going on in the Tory Party, with the media recently deciding that Boris Johnson is basically Hitler. Despite him also being a lifelong London liberal, he’s not fully trusted by TPTB. They’re afraid he might slip up and do things voters actually want.

    A strange thing has happened in British politics since Mrs Thatcher was hounded out of office. We find that successive governments have amazing powers to do things they want to do:

    * Fight two simultaneous wars in Asia? No problem!
    * Commit a trillion £ or four to “climate change”? Done!
    * Turn Britain into a surveillance state that would’ve made the Stasi Jez their pants? Way ahead of you, friendo!

    But when it comes to things voters would like them to do, well, y’see, it’s all very complicated… Did we say we’d reduce immigration? Lower living costs? Leave the EU? What are you, some sort of extremist nut?

    This is, I reckon, the backstory to Tom Watson’s crocodile tears about the Hebrews. Diane Abbott might be thick, but she’s not stupid. She was one of the few Labour MP’s to understand the dangers of the Second Referendum mania that swept the political/media bubble.

    She understands the underhanded game Watson is playing, and she’s right that he should leave the Labour Party. Just as Boris will have to purge a whole bunch of disloyal Tories if he’s going to have a chance of delivering on his promises to voters.

  25. “You could learn to fucking code. Skip the degrees in psychology or English and do computer science.”

    That’s not how it works. Coding is not a skill that can be imparted, it’s an ability. If you haven’t been bedroom coding since you were 12, you will *never* be a coder, regardless of how much training is poured into you. It may be your job title, but you will be crap at it and not *BE* a coder. Teaching and training teaches you *techniques* and experience, not the skill itself.

    Nobody becomes a vet by going to uni, you schlep at the local stables or surgery through your teens doing for the overwhelming love of it, going to uni gets you the qualifications. Similarly, nobody becomes a writer by going to uni, you either *are* a writer and have been writing stories and poems through your teens, and uni polishes you and gives you access to better techniques; or you are not a writer. It is *not* something that can be taught, humans are *NOT* empty programmable vessels.

    Isaac Asimov described it best. He didn’t want to become a writer, he was cursed with *being* a writer, it was an innate ability that he was compelled to express, and he sought out the experience and learning to make his being a writer better, and gods bless him, he managed to make a living out of it.

  26. The Jews thing is the transitive property fallacy combined with asserted facts fallacy that the Left are so fond of leaping down like lemmings.

    (Some) white people are capitalists
    Capitalism is evil
    Therefore: (all) white people are evil.

    (Some) Jewish people are capitalists
    Capitalism is evil
    Therefore: (all) jews are evil!

    There are 275,000 jewish people in the UK, that’s less than half a percent of the population. Shouldn’t the Labour Party be more scared of the 3.3million LibDem voters?

    I’m a member of a minority with only 15,000 members, should I start barricading my home?

  27. Steve,

    “Just as Boris will have to purge a whole bunch of disloyal Tories if he’s going to have a chance of delivering on his promises to voters.”

    He won’t. Boris is a pro-institution, one nation Conservative. He’s not going to burn down the garbage. The only thing he will deliver is Brexit, but even there, does he have the ruthlessness and tactics?

    It’s like Thatcher vs the miners. They won by thinking through what their enemy was going to do, and having defences ready for them. That’s what Boris needs to do.

    The reason I wanted Raab on the final ballot is that he comes across as a ruthless, calculating bastard who would get it done and use whatever tactics were required. And after Brexit, would really go to town on the wasteful bullshit in government.

  28. jgh – it’s not even that, though.

    Labourites are well aware that Jews =/= top-hatted, moustache-twirling bankers. Jon Lansman of Momentumspart fame is a Red Sea Pedestrian, and yet that doesn’t seem to shield him from being smeared as anti-semitical.

    It’s like a Stanley Kubrick movie. The superficial narrative just ain’t what this is about. This war to control Labour is more like the Trots v Stalinist thing, neither side is good, and none of the public denunciations are in good faith.

    BoM4 – You’re quite likely right, I don’t rate Boris’ chances of success very highly. I don’t think Raab would do any better though, much as he’s a seemingly sincere and impressive guy. He has no “oomph”.

  29. “It’s not about the Jews.

    It’s about the political establishment trying to take back control of the Labour Party. ”

    You’re right and wrong.

    These attacks aren’t ‘really’ about anti-semitism in Labour and the Left, correct, its about Deep Remain taking back control of Labour from a Brexiteer. All the facts that are coming out now could have come out as soon as Corbyn took over. But while the attacks are for a purpose unrelated to their apparent point, that doesn’t mean that Labour isn’t a cesspit of actual anti-semitism. It is, maybe not so much at the top (where all the machinations are more about the People’s Front of Judea vs the Judean People’s Front) but at the grass roots levels, there’s a lot of actual spit in your face you dirty Jew hatred going on. Not surprising either, given the way the Muslim bloc vote tends to Labour.

    The irony is that the anti-semitism in Labour is a roots up phenomenon, its not something imposed from the head, thought the head doesn’t mind it too much. Hence why its so intractable – the grass roots want to hate Jews, and the leadership are like Meh,go ahead, we’ll not do anything to stop you.

  30. I have zero idea what’s going on despite following the news closely. Interviewing a labour person of either stripe about it, which happens regularly, is next to useless. No journo that i know has got to the bottom of it. The blairites say that AS often goes under the guise of anti zionism, the Momentum lot claim ‘only’ to be anti zionism and anti the policies of the state of Israel. Left with this the journos inexplicably play softball with the moderates who, let’s remember, are professional politicians, and their insinuation that momentum are really AS with anti zionism as a cover is just left there. I don’t bloody know but i get frustrated that a decent journalist can’t wheedle out some clues as to which it really is.

  31. I don’t bloody know but i get frustrated that a decent journalist can’t wheedle out some clues as to which it really is.

    The problem is that the overlap between anti-Zionism and antisemitism is close to 100%. A journalist attempting to get a cigarette paper between the two is going to struggle.

    Plus the real antisemites (those holding high enough office) are going to be a bit evasive about where they stand on the differences or just plain lie.

    Quite how Jon Landman squares the circle I have no idea, but it’s clear he does since his remarks are consistently within the realms of both anti-Zionism and antisemitism, although which side it lies is lost on me.

    Then again, I’m not a political journalist who is paid to be able to differentiate these things. Not that even political journalists bother with anything close to the truth in the post-Brillo era.

  32. @Steve – Just because the Establishment is trying to shaft Corbyn and his cult by labelling them Jew-haters doesn’t mean the accusation is false .

    There has always been an anti-semitic tone to the loony left, the fact that the loony left has always boasted a few Jews means nothing. What with Leftism being more symptoms than politics, you’ll always get crazies who are Jewish as a chicken soup-smeared bagel yet still would cheerfully see Israel swept into the sea. After all, the left is full of ecomentalists who want ALL of us to die to save Gaia…

    More recently, Labour (not just the cultists) has begun to recognise the value of the Muslim block vote, especially when that vote can be expanded with a nice bit of electoral fraud, just like in the auld country… It turned the Peterborough by-election and who knows how many marginal seats have been stolen previously?

  33. @BniC July 12, 2019 at 9:42 pm

    Correction correct – I misreported, sorry.

    Re less leftie – it would have been top story on BBC, Groan & C4 not buried.

    .
    @Steve

    +1 I’ve never understood why vast majority of Jews in UK & USA (other countries?) support Labour, Democrats, Socialists when those groups hate them and Israel.

    +1 on establishment stitch up & war on BoJo and Corbyn. The msm BoJo project fear is so blatant it must be obvious to most – C4 doing another next week (Dispatches Special?)

    +1 on whole post, insightful

    .
    @others

    +1

  34. @Theo

    Not surprised on reasons, but surprised & pleased they were honest.

    .
    @jgh

    “If you haven’t been bedroom coding since you were 12, you will *never* be a coder”

    Bollocks, if you’ve never tried it you don’t know if you can. I was 19 when first exposed to computers/programing at Uni in ’82 – I changed course to IT

    Otherwise mostly agree.

    .
    @Bloke on M4 July 13, 2019 at 1:30 am

    Sadly, I expect BoJo will deliver May’s vassal state Brexit Brino minus the NI Backstop. I hope I’m wrong and he goes with No Deal, clean break.

  35. @ Pcar
    It’s Gibraltar which is the absolute stumbling block. 96% voted to stay British – Barnier wants us to effectively hand it over to Spain.
    Ireland – nearly as bad but not quite as the Unionists will hold the balance of power between Fiaana Fail and Fine Gael

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