They are fucking different you idiot!

Does this really pass for serious economic comment? And why did Simon Jack not challenge this? In his interview with me, in a part that will not, I suspect, be broadcast he tried to make the same point that there was something wrong with PQE money and I made him agree that all money is created in exactly the same way – as he acknowledged was the case, although he persisted in saying PQE funds were somehow different despite that fact.

One is M0, one is M4. They’re Different!

29 thoughts on “They are fucking different you idiot!”

  1. I have to wonder why Murphy’s lack of knowledge isn’t being more ruthlessly exploited in interview.

    I guess it’s journalists interviewing him, not economists.

    Same with his blitherings about tax. If a tax expert were to be lined up against him, his failings would surely be exposed.

  2. You don’t understand.

    Ritchie is the economics advisor to the next leader of the Labour Party.

    If he says they are the same thing, they are. Because he has credibility which, candidly, you lack.

    And, even if they happen to be different in some neoliberal version of reality, that won’t last because there will be a law passed to criminalise anybody claiming that they are different, neoliberal, reality or otherwise.

  3. In time, Murphy will be undone by the media. Like Corbyn, he is having a honeymoon period. Once his pitch becomes familiar, and the more wild his assertions become, the media will find genuine experts to challenge and slay him. I give him 24 months – at most — before he’s utterly discredited.

  4. Has he simply metamorphosed into “MMT mode”, to the extent that ~ all government spending has now transformed into printed money ~ Ie in his mind M4 borrowing and M0 wrt government no longer “needs” a distinction?

    Just a thought?

  5. Theo

    I’d give him 24 weeks – it’s one day in and already Carney is ‘on the plane home’

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/Jeremy_Corbyn/11820156/Jeremy-Corbyn-will-sack-Bank-of-England-governor-if-they-refuse-to-print-free-money.html

    Once we start putting the De Beers inventory of gems that exist in his TRUK feed (that’s before considering contributions from the likes of Lavrentiy Beria in the comments) he has to be toast well before two years are up…..

  6. @PF

    Do you mean “Modern Monetary Theory” or “Magic Money Tree”?

    Given its Murphy, I think I know, but thought I’d check…

  7. “I made him agree that PQE…”

    Would a normal person (i.e someone without an inferiority complex/acute narcissism) not say:

    “He and I agreed that…”
    Or
    “We shared common ground on…”

  8. Theophrastus,

    The debate is generally defined by the politicians and right now the opposition to him that is talking is only doing so from a perspective of electability (I.e. Labour politicians).

    The Conservatives are staying out of it. They really don’t want to jinx Corbyn winning. But you can bet someone is already getting the numbers together. I’m so looking forward to Richie going up against a big Conservative hitter. I’ll be putting in a double order at JuliaM’s popcorn factory.

  9. Surreptitious Evil

    The cretin clearly also doesn’t understand the concepts of “operational independence” or of setting targets but not methods.

    Both the OBR and the BoE are operationally independent, no matter that their targets are set and their heads appointed by politicians.

    But then, he’s never knowingly been near, or even been vaguely aware of, an economic knob or lever that he hasn’t had a need to grab and change because he, and only he, knows the ideal setting. It may be the model railwayer in him (or indicative of a common cause that makes model railwaying attractive.)

  10. Surreptitious Evil

    Do we reckon we can persuade Julia to start one of those internet subscription models? Daily deliveries may be required.

  11. “JuliaM’s popcorn factory”

    The answer to the question posed today, as billions were wiped off vestments all around the world – “What can one invest in” ..:)

  12. VP – it could be 24 weeks, but journalists are surely not going to start trawling through his ill-written blog until the tide turns against him. At present, his status is as a controversialist. Gradually, his arrogance and egotism will lead him to insult more people and more interviewers (ditto Corbyn) and the journos will become better prepared for each interview.

  13. VP

    You did that on purpose didn’t you?

    Couldn’t you warn us? (Say a “hazard” symbol or something like that directly below the link?)

  14. No, no, no. This is the BBC here so the relevant theorem is not MMT or anything else like that, it is the one which says that the chances of getting anyone to believe something when their job description depends on them not believing it, are zero, zilch fuck all.

    Murphy will never ne callenged on the BBC, because they really really want to believe what he says is true.

    Bit like globla warming, sorry climate change, sorry whatever teh fuck it’s called this week.

  15. VP

    I see what you mean; the narrative’s quite meaty too.

    He is actually quoted as having said:

    any governor who refused to carry out the plan for “people’s quantitative easing” should be “on the next plane” out of Britain

    ie not just the ‘foreign’ chap (if he was still in the job, and which as Frances has pointed out may be unlikely)..!!

    He must surely be crossing the line by now re his grant. Does that suggest he thinks he might be substituting that with a different source of revenue some time soon…

  16. SE. Lay off model railway enthusiasts. We aren’t all power crazies. My little railway is a shining example of Victorian free competition, all guided by a benevolent creator. (Perhaps you have a point….)

    Murphy is getting more arrogant and sounds less reasonable. Only last month he said PQE wouldn’t effect the BoE independence, now it is to be his plaything.

  17. Surreptitious Evil

    Does that suggest he thinks he might be substituting that with a different source of revenue some time soon…

    Three hundred quid just for turning up and Polly’s column in Pravda? That would suit him down to the fen.

  18. Having been inspired by Richard, Julia would learn how to ‘print’ popcorn and become a multi-billionairess. But she wouldn’t forget her fellow bloggers and we would all get life time sized cartons of popcorn for the rest of the performance…

  19. We’re in end times when Charles
    Clarke is the voice of economic reason. (Newsnight tonight had Ann Pettifor talking shite

  20. Glendorran

    Ann Pettifor is potty, plane potty

    But for the record, yes, she thinks that £120bn is collectible, which Murphy apparently doesn’t.

    But then she also thinks, based upon her experiences in Africa, that a central bank is be independent. But then she thinks it must exist to serve “the People”. So she’s the sort of basket case who can contradict herself three times in two sentences.

  21. PF

    Sorry to cause any unnecessary discomfort – I think it is important, as Tim does, to start getting the word out about this thuggish ignoramus who would exile Canadian citizens legally entitled to be here (and who has nothing to say when I ask if he has any concerns about immigration being problematic for some of his schemes) if they failed to follow his whims, hence why I am pasting any mention of him in the mainstream media – please post widely and often and I apologise in advance for any trauma suffered.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/aug/24/cbi-boss-criticises-jeremy-corbyn-peoples-qe-plan

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/Jeremy_Corbyn/11820156/Jeremy-Corbyn-will-sack-Bank-of-England-governor-if-they-refuse-to-print-free-money.html

  22. theoldgreenfascist

    Come on Tim I want to know your definition of M0. Otherwise how can I tell what you are on about?

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