So bikinis objectify women now, do they?

Miss England says she would welcome the opportunity to wear a swimsuit – despite the Miss World competition banning the outfits in order to modernise its image.
Natasha Hemmings said it should be up to the contestants whether they want to wear revealing swimwear, even though the much-derided ‘bikini round’ was ditched in last year after being long-criticised as outdated and sexist.
Miss World, which takes place in China on Saturday, abandoned the controversial requirement for the contestants to appear in a swimsuit after decades of criticism that the show was merely a cattle market, objectifying women’s bodies for the pleasure of male viewers.

Have to admit, that’s not wholly and exactly how I’d describe it.

Generally, the skimpier the bikini the better the woman wearing it thinks the body underneath it is. And the more desirous of showing off that fact she is too.

That is, it’s not an imposed action, it’s a desired one.

Because, amazingly, evolution has led to men having something of an eye for the shape of a bird’s body. and evolution has also left women hunting for the best bloke they can get in that same reproductive sense. On the grounds that that’s what evolution does: concentrates a lot of attention on that reproduction stuff.

Once again it amuses that those who are most insistent that evolution is correct, those lefties who would be horrified at an insistence upon Genesis or other creation story, try to insist upon ignoring the effects of evolution being true.

17 thoughts on “So bikinis objectify women now, do they?”

  1. Art and reality, eh?

    A favourite cartoon of mine from years ago is the Miss Islam beauty pageant, wherein all the girls are wearing burkas…

  2. Generally, the skimpier the bikini the better the woman wearing it thinks the body underneath it is. And the more desirous of showing off that fact she is too.

    We had a young Russian intern working on my floor over the summer and, when I friended her on FB, I discovered that she delights in posing on beaches in very skimpy bikinis. She has the body, and she knows it. When I mentioned it to her, she said “Of course, I want to look beautiful, I want to remember myself this way and also it helps to find a man”.

    It’s not just how Russian women look that makes them fun to be around, it’s also their shameless rejection of feminist tropes.

  3. There is a huge difference between evolution and evolutionary psychology.

    Once again it amuses that those who are most insistent that evolution is correct, those lefties who would be horrified at an insistence upon Genesis or other creation story, try to insist upon ignoring the effects of evolutionary psychology being true.

    would be a more accurate but less amusing way of phrasing it.

  4. “I don’t need to see women just walking up and down in bikinis, it doesn’t do anything for the woman, and it doesn’t do anything for any of us”

    I disagree. It does enough for me.

  5. So Much For Subtlety

    Tim Newman – “When I mentioned it to her, she said “Of course, I want to look beautiful, I want to remember myself this way and also it helps to find a man”.”

    You mentioned it? Brave. The meeting a man thing is the problem. Feminists don’t like that. They want them to meet a lesbian. Preferable in a dark room with impeded eye sight. They just hate humanity.

    100 years of Communism and/or Communist rule and Russians have not yet recovered. They have rejected part of that culture of death but not all of it.

  6. Feminists are at best cool and at worst hostile to evolution. Not all “lefties” are the same. Christina Hoff Summers has noted outright rejection of evolutionary theory among feminists as a white male patiarchal construction.

    Anyone who thinks feminism only want to ban porn, or only nudity, is in cloud cuckoo land. The logical endpoint for Feminism is the burka.

  7. Well, by the definition, yes. But that’s what men do, and just aren’t going to change.

    What’s always amusing to me is how these lefties fight the old wars. Feminists are fighting over Page 3 and Miss World, while blokes are watching gangbangs on the internet.

  8. Well, by the definition, yes. But that’s what men do, and just aren’t going to change.

    They’re Puritans. Their whole worldview is predicated on forcing people to change by suppressing natural urges.

    What’s always amusing to me is how these lefties fight the old wars. Feminists are fighting over Page 3 and Miss World, while blokes are watching gangbangs on the internet.

    Not funny or foolish at all. The key element is excluding these things from the mainstream culture, thus making those who are their enemies “denormalised”. Page 3 is in a newspaper. Miss World is on mainstream telly. While you can still watch gangbangs on the internet (for now) it is forced into a private, shameful sphere.

    They are very good at acquiring moral hegemony, and this is how they do it. Hence the smoker banished from the presence of decent folks, not allowed on the telly, etc etc.

  9. You mentioned it? Brave.

    Not without having got to know her pretty well first, and knowing Russian women pretty well in general. I’d not have mentioned it to a westerner.

  10. Ian B,

    But there isn’t “mainstream culture” like there once was. Broadcast TV and what we call “the press” are just one of thousands of players. My kids watch more Crunchyroll, Amazon and YouTube than the BBC. If there’s something they like on the BBC, or someone at school told them about, or we watch and say “hey, you might like this”, they’ll tune in. My eldest watches about 1 hour of BBC a week. Personally, I’ve watched more Amazon Original drama recently than the BBC stuff, because the BBC would rather make another “female cop in a sexist workplace” like Prime Suspect or Judi Dench in a bonnet than something like The Man in the High Castle. Hell, Outlander is a bit shonky, but it has a better grasp of what history was actually like than Poldark does.

  11. You’re missing the point Stig, it’s down to what is “general” culture and what is “hidden” culture. The right to print pictures of tits in an ordinary newspaper is a statement that tits are okay. Once tits have to be hidden behind warnings, sold in special shops, or forced behind paywalls and ID checks on the internet, it’s no longer part of the general culture and the statement has been made and accepted that tits are dangerous and harmful and only tolerated.

    As I said, like smoking, or any of the other Puritan obsessions.

  12. Some cultures, just finished watching a French police drama (the witnesses) on Netflix and a lot of the characters smoked and not just outdoors though in a restraunt scene they had to go out to smoke, the fact that I noticed shows how much it has changed elsewhere. Pretty good show with some excellent performances

  13. Once again you’re stuck in the mindset of a 70s academic. Feminism in the 21st century looks nothing like what you think it does. The marginal position is the anti porn one.

  14. Matthew L, I would suggest you do a check of how many Feminist organisations and writers are lambasting “objectification”, campaigning against porn, page 3, or even bikinis, compared to the number in favour of those things. Please include mainstream feminist writers, such as those at, say, the Daily Telegraph or Guardian. And popular alt media campaigners like Anita Sarkeesian.

    You will find yourself in an echo chamber of the theory, discourse and narratives developed by the 1970s/80s feminists, particularly the Mackinnon Doctrine.

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