Not a reasonable argument about Donald Trump at all

Lord knows there are plenty of reasonable ones to use against the buffoon:

One must wonder whether the people who seem so enthusiastic about amateur political leadership would be inclined to travel in an airliner flown by an amateur pilot, or to be operated on by an amateur brain surgeon? Why is politics the only area of professional life in which experience and expertise are inherently suspect? Perhaps this is some misunderstanding of the nature of democracy. “Government by the people” is taken to mean that the country should be run by people who know no more than you – who sound just like you on a bad day in which everything and everyone in authority seems to be letting you down.

Democracy means that we are indeed no longer ruled by some special caste. Even if that is a special caste of people who have the right views, believe the right things or, even, are simply competent.

38 thoughts on “Not a reasonable argument about Donald Trump at all”

  1. Politicians appear to have lost the ability to be politically incorrect (NOT Bill Maher style)

    The Donald has not, so unlike any other politician when challenged for being racist, sexist, misogynist or any of the other bullshit excuses for censorship put up by the crybabies of the left, The Donald just keeps right on trucking.

    People are sick and tired of pandering and censorship from the establishment and if electing The Donald will help get rid of that, they are prepared to do that.

    How can Shillary compete?

  2. The analogy between pilot and airplane is a devious one which implies there is a certain skills set to be achieved if one wants to be a politicial leader/politician.

    Instead we have seen the creation of a politicial class, cocooned in a bubble, that takes them from university. Thru bag carrier, special adviser and even local councils. To parachuted MP into the Westminster gravy train.

    Not once a long the way do they get their hands dirty working at the coal face. Nor do they have any real experience of the life us plebs lead. Trying to make ends meet and do the best for our famillies.

    Yet all the time they are insisting they know how best to govern our lives, run our businesses, educate our children. Ruin the values and culture of our once fair land out of petty spite for us.

    Well quite frankly it’s about time we had a few more “amateurs” running things. A trend I hope that does come across the Pond to us here in the UK soon.

  3. The only ability a professional politician has is to look you in the eye and tell you a barefaced lie, not caring that you know that he is lying.

    Who needs it?

  4. Not a great comparison he’s making as an amatuer pilot would still be trained and certified to some level

  5. “Why is politics the only area of professional life in which experience and expertise are inherently suspect?”

    *looks at the Kinnocks, and the Benns…*

  6. a professional politician has is to look you in the eye and tell you a barefaced lie, not caring that you know that he is lying

    And, out in industry, we call them salespeople. Or, occasionally, the more worrying sort of project manager.

  7. The wicked fat cow.

    Professional liars, thieves, and murderers. Just what we fucking need.

    Indeed it is so stupid as a justification for allowing an evil caste to lord it over the rest of us that it cannot be mere stupidity.

  8. If only he mentioned that the professional pilot has sold your seat to several different people, consistently lies to you about the direction the aeroplane is travelling in and then deliberately crashes it into a mountainside because he despises you, having first parachuted to safety.

  9. John Galt

    Except the Donald isn’t thay breath of fresh you think is he. He’s a sale who recognises a mug when he sees one. And.when he gets it slightly wrong, misjudges hiarket – wen should be punished etc – he quickly apologises and becomes all politically correct just like the rest of them.

    I’d like to think.I’m not a mug. I’ve seen him coming. I see some he haven’t.

  10. Ironman – And.when he gets it slightly wrong, misjudges hiarket – wen should be punished etc – he quickly apologises and becomes all politically correct just like the rest of them.

    Nah.

    I’d like to think.I’m not a mug.

    You thought Rubio was a contender.

  11. “Why is politics the only area of professional life in which experience and expertise are inherently suspect”

    Janet Daley misunderstands the experience and expertise that we seek. We aren’t looking for people who know about the machinery of government, we’re looking for people to represent us. And we’re rightfully suspicious of people who have gone native. They stop caring about us and start caring about their friends.

    And god damn it I hate to defend Trump, but can someone tell me what’s wrong with this:-

    “In a television interview, he declared that should abortion become criminalised again by a change in the law, he would advocate punishing women who underwent abortions, as well as those who performed them.”

    Now, unlike our host, I’m pro-choice (I would reduce the term to 12 weeks), but if it were illegal, why shouldn’t the woman with the baby in her, the person requesting the criminal activity, be charged? We don’t let people off who hire an assassin to bump off their husbands.

  12. To be a leader of a country, you need experience in leading. I think Trump has that, as shown by the way he has led his companies to success. To be a leader of a country, you need experience in organising disparate groups of people all with conflicting interests and needs and desires so that they all work together for the benefit of the organisation. I think Trump has shown that ability by the way he has led his companies to success.

  13. Janet mostly talks good sense (imho), but every now and again goes off and gets her knickers in a complete twist, usually on some subject close to her…

  14. Janet Daley is one of those reliably useless conservatives who talks a great game on sovereignty, immigration, etc. but – as soon as somebody looks like being able to actually do something about those issues – shows her true beliefs by sticking a rhetorical knife in their back.

    She’d rather be a dignified loser than do what’s necessary to smash the Left’s frame.

    For example:

    Donald Trump must be the most dangerously ignorant man ever to run for the leadership of a modern democratic country.

    Meanwhile, David Cameron still thinks Islam is “a religion of peace”.

    Who’s more dangerously ignorant, boys and ghouls?

    Aware of the danger of his long-standing reputation for being pro-choice, he made a desperate opportunistic lunge towards the militant anti-abortion rhetoric of the hard-core religious Right within the Republican base. In a television interview, he declared that should abortion become criminalised again by a change in the law, he would advocate punishing women who underwent abortions, as well as those who performed them. The roof fell in.

    Which just goes to show why, after 40 years of decrying Roe v Wade, the US Religious Right has utterly failed to do anything about it.

    They don’t want to stop abortion. They just want to preen their evangelical feathers in public. They’re not Christians, they’re Pharisees.

    The remark was so appalling that they scarcely needed to add anything.

    Suggesting women have agency and should be held responsible for their actions is “appalling”. Good to know.

    Taken alongside the refusal to apologise for his press spokesman manhandling a female reporter

    There’s a video of the alleged “manhandling” on Youtube. You’d need to be a JFK conspiracy theorist with 10,000 hours experience analysing the Zapruder film to convince yourself you can see Trump’s campaign manager making anything but the most fleeting physical contact with the female reporter.

    The female reporter changed her original story after she found out there was a video.

    Her only physical evidence is a picture she took some days after the event showing tiny bruises on her forearm, which could’ve come from anywhere.

    And she has a history of making outlandish attention-seeking claims like this.

    But as Janet’s already established, owning a vagina means never been held accountable for your actions. Because, uh, misogyny.

    Anyway, Trump’s bad.

    What it has done to the image of the Republican Party may take a generation to overcome.

    Indeed. The Republican Party may never retain its image of being useless liars who pretend they’re going to do what their voters want, then bend over and take it up the elephant hole from the Democrats.

    The Economist Intelligence Unit recently described the election of Donald Trump as one of the top 10 risk events to the global economy

    Lol.

    Maybe that’s a warning that needs to be repeated regularly because high-minded intellectuals are constantly being caught out. In Italy, in the 1930s, they were saying: “This can’t be happening here. This is the country of Dante and Michelangelo.” In Germany, they were saying: “This can’t be happening here. This is the country of Goethe and Beethoven.” I’m sure in America now, there are reasonable people saying: “This can’t be happening here. This is the country of Jefferson and Lincoln.”

    Translation: TRUMP IS LITERALLY HITLAH! LISTEN TO ME! I’M REASONABLE! WAIT, WHERE ARE YOU GOING? COME BACK!

  15. The Other Bloke in Italy

    Some time ago, I rather went off Janet. Now. I realise it was because she is, as described in illuminating detail by Steve, a Cuckservative. A very useful term. Unlike Janet.

  16. So Much For Subtlety

    So Ms Daley is about to apologise for the Civil War (ours, not hers) and admit that Charles I was right all along?

    Good.

    Time to recognise that democracy was a bad idea and what we need is not so much someone who is a professional, but someone who is so professional they have been training at it their entire lives.

    Bring back the Divine Rights of Kings and a powerful House of Lords containing only the Hereditaries.

  17. Trouble is in a democracy it is the people who decide on the competence of politicians. And indeed on their competence and honesty. No person or group of persons can decide, against the will of the majority, who is competent.
    The alternative is to abolish democracy. I doubt if Ms Daley will find her views prevail once that has happened.

  18. Steve: ” In Italy, in the 1930s, they were saying: “This can’t be happening here. This is the country of Dante and Michelangelo.”

    They must also have been asking : “How come we know nothing about history”.

    Seeing that Musso had taken over and consolidated his power by about 1927.

  19. So Much For Subtlety

    Steve – “Donald Trump must be the most dangerously ignorant man ever to run for the leadership of a modern democratic country.”

    Hard to believe someone has said that while Obama is still in office.

    “They don’t want to stop abortion. They just want to preen their evangelical feathers in public. They’re not Christians, they’re Pharisees.”

    Absolutely. Abortion is, in fact if not in law, murder. We punish murderers.

    “Lol.”

    It is hard to remember when the Economist was last right about anything. We would be better off doing exactly the opposite of what they recommend.

    “Maybe that’s a warning that needs to be repeated regularly because high-minded intellectuals are constantly being caught out. In Italy, in the 1930s, they were saying: “This can’t be happening here. This is the country of Dante and Michelangelo.””

    You know, I might be wrong, but I suspect that Dante and Michelangelo were familiar with politics more brutal and violent than anything Trump is likely to do. What does she think very early 14th century Italy was like? Michelangelo had to flee Florence when his patrons, the Medicis were down on their luck and the city was run by Savonarola.

  20. TOBIL – If you look up “Cuckservative” in the Oxford English dictionary, there’s a picturevof Janet Daley next to it.

    You might think it’s Zelda from Terrahawks, but trust me, that’s Janet without makeup on.

    Ecks – yes, but to be fair she only put Il Duce in there because of the rule of three. The main point was to call Trump Hitler.

    He’s exactly like Hitler. Except for the racism. And the gas-the-Jews thing. And the warmongering thing. And the national socialism thing.

    But otherwise, exactly like Hitler.

    SMFS – I suspect that Dante and Michelangelo were familiar with politics more brutal and violent than anything Trump is likely to do

    Even 19th century US elections were far more brutal than anything Trump has done or is likely to do.

    Trump calling fat women fat, or weak men weak only hurts them cos it’s true. Their tears are delicious.

  21. So Much For Subtlety

    Steve – “Even 19th century US elections were far more brutal than anything Trump has done or is likely to do.”

    Well, I am still living in hope. Maybe someone ought to send me the complete Game of Thrones series and explain to him the virtues of ruling on a pile of your enemies’ bones?

    “Trump calling fat women fat, or weak men weak only hurts them cos it’s true. Their tears are delicious.”

    And yet White men have a deeply rooted need to White Knight which is more powerful than anything else out there.

    Personally I would vote for Trump because of the Babes:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3520973/Babes-Trump-Twitter-page-tries-Make-America-Great-photos-scantily-clad-women-promoting-GOP-frontrunner.html

    Picture Hillary in any of those pictures.

  22. “Democracy means that we are indeed no longer ruled by some special caste.”

    Tosh.

    Yes we are, it is just that they are no longer called ‘barons’, but nevertheless are the most influential and wealthy in the land who select the ‘king’.

    In any case we do not have democracy, we have voting – they are not synonymous – we just vote for the barons’ choice and we all pretend it was ‘the People’ wot decided.

    Demockracy has replaced religion as the opium of the People.

  23. Picture Hillary in any of those pictures.

    I can’t even think about opening a link that includes scantily clad women after that mental image. Time to break out the mind bleach.

    The pilot analogy is interesting. The airline will have an autopilot that is able to also most situations without any input. The president has a bureaucracy which does the same thing. Career politicians turn off the autopilot to crash the plane into a mountain all the time. Why would Trump be any different?

    As much as I don’t want to see President Trump I do prefer him to almost everyone that the Republicans have put forth in my lifetime. Hopefully this will lead to better candidates in the future.

  24. Bloke in North Dorset

    lgh is correct. The professionalism in government is supposed* to come from the Civil Service. They are the ones who understand policy development and implementation, MPs are their to decide which policies and oversight.

  25. Igh? D

    id I miss a comment somewhere as that is the point I was trying to make?

    Does Igh stand for something I should know by now?

  26. Bloke in Costa Rica

    If you think Trump is a dangerously ignorant buffoon* you should listen to the shit that comes out of Bernie Sanders’ mouth. As for the nails-down-a-blackboard screeching that is Hillary’s stock-in-trade: is it time to run a hot bath and open a vein? It’s really Cruz by default, despite the awful Jesus-bothering. Of course if Trump is kneecapped at the conference, a lot of his supporters are going to stay home, so we get the Wicked Witch, in which case we are truly fucked.

    * spoiler: he is

  27. BICR – I can’t see Cruz winning the presidency. Have you seen him talk? Awful. Just awful.

    He comes across like a creepy religious hypocrite straight out of central casting. There is something of the Night of the Hunter about that man.

    Camille Paglia drew a very accurate sketch of him:

    Trump with his pragmatic real-life record is a far more palatable national figure than Ted Cruz, whose unctuous, vainglorious professions of Christian piety don’t pass the smell test. Trump is a blunt, no-crap mensch, while Cruz is a ham actor, doling out fake compassion like chopped liver. Cruz’s lugubrious, weirdly womanish face, with its prim, tight smile and mawkishly appealing puppy-dog eyebrows, is like a waxen mask, always on the verge of melting. This guy doesn’t know who the hell he is—and the White House is no place for him and us to find out.

  28. Bloke in Costa Rica

    The problem with Camille Paglia is she talks a good game but you just know she’s going to pull the lever for Maleficent.

  29. BiCR,

    Have you actually looked at Cruz’s platform? It doesn’t take any real work to break down his economic plans and realize that he would be a complete disaster. If he had his way we would be looking at deficits approaching $3 trillion until the entire government collapses. Since that is his goal anyway I’m sure it doesn’t bother him at all but I don’t want his version of anarchy.

    Trump may be an arrogant asshat but he isn’t nearly as dangerous as Cruz. What is scary is that as I age I become more conservative but the ‘conservative’ party keeps putting forward more and more radical options. The only positive is that I finally understand the lyrics “mister we could use a man like Herbert Hoover again”.

  30. BICR – Camille’s a Bernietard.

    LY – Cruz won’t be your president. Who’s going to vote for him?

    He appeals to Ned Flanderseses who think they’re all going to be Raptured up to heaven next week, Mormons, spergs who think the Constitution is magic, and slow-witted Midwestern conservatives who think it’s still 1992 and culture war posturing is the in-thing.

    His fan base is almost exclusively white, so thanks to the malicious population replacement policies of your betters, he’d need to capture an overwhelming share of the white vote to get into the (ahem) White House. That means energising the Republican base and peeling off a chunk of blue collar Democrat voters.

    Mitt Romney couldn’t pull it off, and he was less obviously creepy than Cruz.

    So, nah. It’s Trump. He’ll win the white vote, bring in the sort of working class patriotic Democrats Reagan appealed to, and perform much better than Republicans usually do with blacks and hispanics.

    He’s the only man in the race.

  31. So Much For Subtlety

    Steve – “His fan base is almost exclusively white, so thanks to the malicious population replacement policies of your betters”

    In other words, classical liberalism is dead. It never appealed to anyone outside of WASPs and they have been betrayed. Their countries handed over to feckless Third World illiterates.

    We won’t be much behind them.

  32. I have a horrible feeling that at some point in the next few months the ghost of Lee Harvey Oswald will appear for the Donald….I truly hope I am wrong.

  33. The Inimitable Steve

    In other words, classical liberalism is dead. It never appealed to anyone outside of WASPs and they have been betrayed.

    The GOP has an enduring fantasy that Mexicans are “natural conservatives”, and if they just pander to them enough they’ll all vote for the rich white guys rather than the party of identity politics and free goodies.

    And of course they’re natural conservatives. Just look at Mexico.

  34. “Why is politics the only area of professional life in which experience and expertise are inherently suspect?”

    The problem with her question is the politics is not an area of professional life at all.

  35. Mark, I have that feeling too.

    The virulence of the denunciations of Trump, the astonishing silliness of the establishment across the West, the febrile atmosphere being stoked up by so many in the media – all these make real violence almost inevitable.

    I also truly hope I’m wrong.

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