Shameless, just shamelessNovember 27, 2016 Tim WorstallFlatulent tosspottery25 CommentsThe Guardian’s obituary of Castro written by…..Richard Gott, a KGB agent of influence. previousExcellent!nextDear God, really? 25 thoughts on “Shameless, just shameless” Fred November 27, 2016 at 12:09 pm Remarkably revisionist… Ironman November 27, 2016 at 12:20 pm Communist dictator’s obituary written by communist traitor. Nothing else to say about his really. Nemo November 27, 2016 at 12:39 pm Nicht so gross gott? Gamecock November 27, 2016 at 12:41 pm The obit doesn’t mention Huber Matos. I was 10 when Castro took over Cuba. From what I saw on TV, Fulgencio Batista deserved to be overthrown. I liked Castro. I got a fatigue painters cap. But within a year, he betrayed the revolution, and became dictator. Then he formed an alliance with the Soviets. Cuba under the Castros is only one step down from North Korea. So Much For Subtlety November 27, 2016 at 12:58 pm The Guardian continues its support for the wrong side in every struggle but especially the Cold War. Big deal. It is not as if any decent person took them seriously So Much For Subtlety November 27, 2016 at 1:11 pm A better obituary of Castro in so far as it is about his legacy: http://www.city-journal.org/html/last-communist-city-13649.html Hallowed Be November 27, 2016 at 1:27 pm Subs seem to have given him a wide berth. “In January 1959, Castro, aged 30, arrived in triumph in Havana. The Cuban revolution had begun.” – he would have been 32 then. Chris Miller November 27, 2016 at 2:43 pm Fulgencio Batista deserved to be overthrown No argument from me. But Batista had Castro in jail on a 15 year sentence (he was released after 2). If he’d been the evil bastard currently portrayed, it would have been trivially easy for Castro to have ‘disappeared’, as he himself later disappeared tens of thousands of his opponents. Jonathan November 27, 2016 at 2:54 pm “Cuba under Fidel was a country where indigenous nationalism was at least as significant as imported socialism, ” I thought Nationalism was bad? Steve Crook November 27, 2016 at 3:02 pm BBC R4 Today had him on as well. Interviewer tried to get him to address Castro’s human rights ‘issues’, poverty etc, etc, but he seemed to go temporarily deaf and to be unable to hear the questions. He, like Corbyn, would have excused Castro just about anything. What was shameful was that the BBC didn’t have someone on hand to put a forward an alternative narrative. Something they managed to do on other programmes. Rob November 27, 2016 at 3:39 pm Scott Trust: Stop funding Hate Gamecock November 27, 2016 at 4:33 pm ‘If he’d been the evil bastard currently portrayed’ http://latinamericanhistory.about.com/od/historyofthecaribbean/a/08fbatista.htm ‘He established the Unitary Action Party and ran for president in 1952, assuming that most Cubans had missed him during his years away. Soon, it became apparent that he would lose: he was running a distant third to Roberto Agramonte of the Ortodoxo Party and Dr. Carlos Hevia of the Auténtico party. Fearful of losing entirely his weakening grip on power, Batista and his allies in the military decided to take control of the government by force.’ Seems evil to me. Do you see gradations of evil? Like being less evil than Castro makes him okay? Matthew L November 27, 2016 at 5:39 pm Chris Miller: That looks more like oversight than mercy, given that Batista was responsible for thousands of deaths as well. Street Sparrow November 27, 2016 at 6:36 pm Sadly my Observer reading wife, who has been to Cuba, is lapping this up and tells me that Castro was a benign dictator and not as bad as North Korea. By her reckoning Trump’s description of Castro as a brutal dictator is a gaffe rather than a pithy summary. I’m trying to educate her but it’s a long process. BobRocket November 27, 2016 at 7:41 pm Castro was a tyrant but he wouldn’t have held on to power if he had been anything else. He managed to stall American expansionism with the missile crisis that was caused by US missiles in Turkey. He emptied the jails and deported the prisoners to Miami which must be a win for ordinary Cubans by any stretch, if we could deport 75% of our to France we would be laughing. He wasn’t any worse than any of the Dictators the US supports (Stroessner, Pinochet, Fujimori or Saud for example). He resisted US sponsored overthrow (unlike Iran). The big question is, are our current leaders going to get off their collective high horses and help the ordinary Cuban people join the 21st century or are they going to allow their prejudices to continue to hold those people to ransom. I don’t hold out any hope because our leaders are no better than Castro, they understand that that our populace has a higher limit to overcome but it doesn’t stop them pushing the envelope. If it wasn’t for the lessons of past and current history keeping them in check, Castro and his ilk would seem like a beneficial libertarians. Chester Draws November 27, 2016 at 7:53 pm He wasn’t any worse than any of the Dictators the US supports (Stroessner, Pinochet, Fujimori or Saud for example). Two wrongs don’t make a right. That the US continues to support the Saudi royal family is a disgrace. But it doesn’t make Castro a good man. An acceptable man. Not even a liberator (given that the country was less free under him than it had been previously). dcardno November 27, 2016 at 8:23 pm He wasn’t any worse than any of the Dictators the US supports (Stroessner, Pinochet, Fujimori or Saud for example). Pinochet is a very poor example. Under Pinochet the lives of average Chilenos improved, they became both increasingly free and wealthy, and eventually he relinquished power after a democratic vote. Compare and contrast to Castro’s performance in Cuba – a country that *should* be wealthier, given resources, transport issues, and access to markets. Bloke in North Dorset November 27, 2016 at 9:41 pm Street Sparrow, Good luck with that. I’ve spent a fair bit of time today on a sailing forum pointing out that Castro murdered, tortured and imprisoned his opponents on an industrial scale and that he’d left his country still in the grip of a brutal dictatorship and one of the poorest countries in the world. But that’s OK, apparently, because they have a free health service, it didn’t matter that Cuba couldn’t afford even basic medicines, and the Cubans they’d met when they visited were all happy. And anyway it was all the fault of the USA and its illegal embargo, yes someone thought America refusing to trade with Cuba was illegal, and US healthcare isn’t free. There really is none so blind as those who will not see. dearieme November 27, 2016 at 9:54 pm “Do you see gradations of evil?” Are you competing for Stupid Question of the day? BobRocket November 27, 2016 at 10:20 pm Chester, dcardno, yes, Castro was a cunt but he is dead now. He was no worse and no better than any other cunt who wields power without accountability. The question is, will our leaders (who aren’t dead yet) punish the ordinary Cubans any more just to further their own obscene quest for power or will they do the decent thing and offer to help rehabilitate the population ? Bloke in North Dorset November 27, 2016 at 11:43 pm There is no “but” when it comes to authoritarians, whether on the left or right. dcardno November 28, 2016 at 12:07 am …will our leaders (who aren’t dead yet) punish the ordinary Cubans… I suppose that depends on what the current leaders of Cuba (who also aren’t dead) do, doesn’t it? It seems to me that Raul his continued the policies of his late brother, which do rather a better job of punishing the “ordinary Cubans” than anything the outside world has done, including US sanctions. No doubt, Cubans would be (slightly) richer if they could trade with the US – but given the state of the Cuban economy there is little they could offer in trade. They would be immensely richer if they had a market oriented economy, even with US sanctions in place. So Much For Subtlety November 28, 2016 at 12:22 am Matthew L – “That looks more like oversight than mercy, given that Batista was responsible for thousands of deaths as well.” Source? Batista allowed other political parties in Cuba. How many are there now? Batista allowed student protests and independent Trade Unions. How many are there now? Batista did not create committee of vigilantes on every street and encourage children to denounce their parents. There is no comparison. Especially as Castro has not kill thousands, he has killed hundreds of thousands. Twenty percent of the population now lives in exile. More Americans lived in Cuba under Batista than Cubans lived in America. BobRocket – “Castro was a tyrant but he wouldn’t have held on to power if he had been anything else.” You think that is true about Pol Pot, Stalin and Hitler too? “He managed to stall American expansionism with the missile crisis that was caused by US missiles in Turkey.” Sorry but what the f*ck? The missile crisis was caused by Soviet expansionism, specially putting Soviet missiles into Cuba. The Turkish missiles were a last minute concession that was irrelevant to the dispute. “He emptied the jails and deported the prisoners to Miami ” He emptied the jails of criminals. He did not let any political prisoners go. “He wasn’t any worse than any of the Dictators the US supports (Stroessner, Pinochet, Fujimori or Saud for example).” Yes he was. How many political parties are there in Peru? How many in Cuba again? “He resisted US sponsored overthrow (unlike Iran).” Unfortunately for the people of Cuba. “The big question is, are our current leaders going to get off their collective high horses and help the ordinary Cuban people join the 21st century or are they going to allow their prejudices to continue to hold those people to ransom.” Indeed. The 101st Airborne ought to do it. “I don’t hold out any hope because our leaders are no better than Castro” F*ck off you c*nt. Mr Ecks November 28, 2016 at 1:45 am You are full of shit on this one Bob. Castro was way worse than Pinochet. That is no endorsement of Pinochet but the left are always more evil. Look at Hitler. Gamecock November 28, 2016 at 3:01 am “The big question is, are our current leaders going to get off their collective high horses and help the ordinary Cuban people join the 21st century or are they going to allow their prejudices to continue to hold those people to ransom.’ Invasion is against international law. WTF is “join the 21st century?” Leave a Reply Cancel replyYour email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *Comment Name * Email * Website Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment.