TimWorstall 16m ago

0
1
Oh dear, oh dear:

“But even Apple cannot escape concerns about its possession of so much private power. It stands on the threshold of being the world’s first trillion-dollar company. It pays trivial amounts of tax in relation to its sales.”

Apple’s sales, some $215 billion. Tax paid, some $10 billion. No, that’s tax paid, not tax that should be but isn’t.

Walmart sales, $485 billion. Tax paid $4.5 billion.

Apple has half the sales and pays twice the tax and this isn’t enough?

Or, perhaps, the writers of the editorial need to remind themselves that we don’t in fact tax sales at the corporate level, we tax profits?

28 thoughts on “Sigh”

  1. The comment above yours is hilarious:

    “So my new iPad has fingerprint recognition which was cool at first until amazon prime now keeps requesting my fingerprint.”

    He really thinks Amazon gets his fingerprint from his iPad?

  2. “Nobody argues the services they provide would have happened faster or more efficiently in a world of public ownership and state planning. And yet. These are new and powerful sources of private power. These companies know ever more about us: our personal data is integral to their business model. They take the concept of monopoly to a new level; each digital platform, once dominant, creates an embedded advantage of being the only platform worth using, so making their market position unchallengeable.”

    How the fuck does anyone think Apple are a monopoly? Maybe if you’re a man bun-sporting Nathan Barley type in Shoreditch, the iPhone is a necessity, but most of the market isn’t Apple’s, it’s Android.

  3. Maybe it’s not sensible, but I’ve always been somewhat prejudiced against Apple. Ever since the early days, when computers first came in, when we’d be sitting somewhat overwhelmed trying to keep up with some presentation on how to operate some clunky, awkward and totally unfamiliar software, when someone at the the would raise their hand and wimper…. “I’ve got a Mac….”

  4. How the fuck does anyone think Apple are a monopoly? Maybe if you’re a man bun-sporting Nathan Barley type in Shoreditch, the iPhone is a necessity, but most of the market isn’t Apple’s, it’s Android.

    Indeed, Android has unleashed the mighty power of Chinese manufacturing. I was just looking at that well known brand Elephone S8 – a sensational piece of kit for €200. I expect there are ten other brands making equivalent products at the same price level…

    I simply can’t see how Apple fanboys can justify ~£500 on the latest iPhone when that sort of technology is available so cheaply…

  5. Bloke in Cyprus: because software is also a technology. On iPhones the hardware and software are tightly integrated, much, much, more than is possible with the mix and match that is Android.

    You might as well argue that everyone should buy the cheapest car that does the job. Some of us like the extra polish.

  6. Bloke in Cyprus,

    There are some advantages to the iPhone. The camera is better. They tend to use the latest processors.

    We should all thank the fanboys, though. Component makers can invest in R&D because of lots of people wanting the latest and greatest. Once it’s no longer latest and greatest, it trickles down to everyone else. You also see this with graphics cards. Some people really want their games with higher frame rates and more resolution and will pay £800 for it. The people who paid that in 2012 mean I get the same for about £40 today.

  7. Bloke in Cyprus: because software is also a technology. On iPhones the hardware and software are tightly integrated, much, much, more than is possible with the mix and match that is Android.

    I accept that but Andoid is pretty bloody good too. I have a Moto G 4th Generation and there really aren’t gaping holes in the integration of the apps. And I paid £164.

    There are some advantages to the iPhone. The camera is better. They tend to use the latest processors.

    The €200 Chinese phone I mentioned has a 10-core processor and 21Mp Sony camera!

  8. How does the Graun know anything about tax? It’s never paid any.

    And notice how it doesn’t have a filthy capitalist paywall. Instead it solicits tax free donations.

    Just to make sure everything is tax free, it’s set up that fraudulent charity.

  9. “The €200 Chinese phone I mentioned has a 10-core processor and 21Mp Sony camera!”

    Those aren’t everything. A core is just a CPU. You can have cores of different clock speeds.And the quality of sensors is more than just megapixels.

  10. Those aren’t everything. A core is just a CPU. You can have cores of different clock speeds.And the quality of sensors is more than just megapixels.

    Well yes…

    But the deca core processor runs at 2.5GHz and the camera is made by Sony.

    It has 4Gbytes RAM and 64Gbytes storage.

    All for €200.

    It is hard to imagine that it gives a significantly inferior performance to the latest iPhone which costs three times as much…

  11. Sorry, but this whole Fonewars thing goes straight over my head. It’s a phone FFS. It’s very nice they now send messages & have cameras for taking snaps.
    But does anyone seriously use them for writing correspondence? (Or maybe they do. Judging by the appalling errors & predictive text artefacts turn up in so much I receive) What sort of trivial valueless lives do people have, to spend so much of their time playing with them?

  12. “Ever since the early days, when …”: actually, when Macs were far superior. They really were. I was never once tempted to pick up a Mac and hurl it across the room shouting “which fucking idiot programmed you?”. That was a common occurrence with PCs. It was the PC that taught me that the mark of most software people was that they were modestly clever but considered themselves terribly clever.

    I remember the groans of agony when the Mac users in our lab were pushed onto using PCs. The clincher was that Apple had started selling unreliable hardware.

    Or I could argue that the early days for me were the days of the Commodore PET, the first personal computer I used. I liked it. I never warmed to the IBM/Microsoft PCs: they incorporated just too much stupidity.

  13. My phone make phone calls. Sometimes I text, take a photo, or even use the internet occasionally. Forgot what brand it is.

  14. My phone makes phone calls, does text messages, and is my alarm clock. That is the totality of its functionality, and it cost me about fifteen of our British pounds.

  15. “My phone makes phone calls, does text messages, and is my alarm clock.”

    To which I would add “and is also my watch”.

    Nokia made them very, very well, and they can still be easily picked up, discontinued or otherwise.

  16. Sorry but your comparison with Walmart (a low margin business) is pointless at best. As we all now, corporate taxes are mostly levied on profits. In 2016 Apple paid about $15bn tax and had $45bn of net income, an effective rate of around 25%, which is low particularly considering that Apple has been around for nearly 40 years and is a mature company and that it doesn’t have a lot of manufacturing machinery giving a lot of accelerated tax depreciation charges. So the rate is low, but not exactly scandalously low.

  17. I use the phone to do a bunch of stuff. Appointments, travel journal, get told about sales on ebay and amazon, get emails, take some photos and so on.
    Wife watches youtube videos, goes on facebook, looks up films, does a bit of shopping.
    One thing we hardly use it for is as a telephone. Perhaps a couple of calls a month made using it and maybe one incoming call a month.

  18. Bloke in North Dorset

    My iPad and iPhone are chart plotters and navigation aids. They receive signals which tell me where the big ships and if I’m on collision course. I can quickly look up tides and current flows for any time in up to the end of 2018 for passage planning, that would normally be a 15 minute job by the time I’ve dug out all the various almanacs and tidal streams. They also act as anchor alarms.

    That alone saved me a minimum of £1000.

    The problem is that the cost of charts and various apps, as well as a load of OS maps for when I’m hiking mean I’m virtually locked on to iOS.

  19. Bi Cyprus: thanks for introducing me to the elephone.

    You’re very welcome…

    I’m currently working on persuading Mrs. BiC that my Moto G would be sooo much better than her phone that she should upgrade to it so that I can order an Elephone…

  20. @bloke in spain, September 10, 2017 at 12:50 pm

    Sorry, but this whole Fonewars thing goes straight over my head. It’s a phone FFS…

    +1

  21. @dearieme, September 10, 2017 at 12:56 pm

    …Or I could argue that the early days for me were the days of the Commodore PET, the first personal computer I used. I liked it…

    Snap. Their use of IEE 488 daisy chain to link peripherals to the PC was inspired.

  22. There are a load of people who think that corporation tax should be paid on sales rather than on profits. They see the deduction of costs as a loophole, rather than being the point.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *