Well, yes, no doubt

But the question is, do we want to?

People who voted for Brexit made a “stupid” decision which could still be reversed by the British public, one of the EU’s most powerful officials said yesterday.

Martin Selmayr, chief of staff to the European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker, said it was “legally” possible for the UK to reverse its decision to leave.

It could, of course, be true that we don’t like the EU’s usual insistence on repeating votes until the “right” answer is reached…..

29 thoughts on “Well, yes, no doubt”

  1. Have you fucked off yet, Selmayr Minor?

    Thought I saw your arse disappearing along the corridor,when someone high up called out ‘BOY’!

  2. You know the European Commission for a group of people convinced the it has all of the bargaining power in the Brexit negotiations, they aure seem keen for the British to change there decision.

    It’s almost as if the 4% tariff they can inflicit on the UK (less whatever gets through the unguarded Irish border) isn’t given the leverage that they expected.

    It will dawn on the commission at some stage that if they can’t get Britain to pay for the EU going forward they can do what exactly?

  3. The gentleman could avail himself of a bottle of scotch and a revolver. Indeed were he a true gentleman he would already have done so.
    Of course if he and his colleagues were to follow this advice, there would be a far higher chance of persuading the British electorate to change its mind.

  4. I love being called stupid. I’ve been called stupid over Brexit so many times this past year and a bit. Recently somebody leapt into my Facebook conversation to make a snide remark about me being a wilful fool. When I offered debate he told me he didn’t debate Brexit as “I get so emotiona it sometimes makes me cry”.

    The beauty of being called stupid is it removes any need for tact or civility when I respond.

  5. benaud: “It will dawn on the commission at some stage that if they can’t get Britain to pay for the EU going forward they can do what exactly?”

    They can do as Henry Crun & Sen. C.R.O’Blene suggest, of course!

  6. The Unused Testicle

    Every time one of the EU royalty opens their mouth, I’m glad I’m leaving,

    The difference between me and these people is that if I’d lost a client paying me £50 billion a year I’d think I was the one who was stupid…

  7. @TUT

    Imagine if a client went away, and you still tried to extract cash from them long-term.

    I’ve seen it – “file closure fees” that make it expensive to move the cases. And hoooooo, nothing confirms the client’s decision to bog off than such fees.

  8. The word “stupid” is banded about by Remainers in the sense that four year olds use it, I.e. a generic term of abuse because they haven’t the brains yet to argue in more depth. Just laugh at them.

    he told me he didn’t debate Brexit as “I get so emotiona it sometimes makes me cry”.

    This is interesting. He is trying to imply that he is so passionately involved that it reduces him to tears, but I think the reason is more subtle – he has had his way for so long, has never had to defend his worldview for so long that when he suffers a reverse he is reduced to tears of impotent rage because he lacks the rhetorical weapons to stop it.

  9. All you need to consider when evaluating whether Brexit or Remain was and is the right choice is this:

    Lord Murphy O’Tool is in favour of Remain

  10. The annual transfer from the UK to the UK is more on the order of £10-12 billion.

    The economic value of staying in was most likely to be positive – nowhere near the extremes that the cretins in HMT projected, but there will probably be costs to leaving.

    There are gainers and losers from exiting – and the remainers seem to assume that everyone is “stupid” for voting to leave. In fact it makes eminent sense for a significant portion of the UK population.

    The educated globalised elite benefit from migration, but the less educated non elites do not.

    The EU’s actions with regard to the migrant crisis show that it is run as a scam to maximise their own power and not to actually enforce the law or benefit the voters of the EU. Together with the idiocy that is the Euro, I suspect that the EU will collapse at some point – probably with bloodshed.

    BTW anyone who tells you

    a) Macron is the future of the EU
    or
    b) The EU prevented war

    really is stupid.

  11. Bloke in North Dorset

    “All you need to consider when evaluating whether Brexit or Remain was and is the right choice is this:

    Lord Murphy O’Tool is in favour of Remain”

    Is he, I thought he decided being out allowed him to have his curajus state? Or was that before he weasled himself on to the \EU teat?

  12. The EU can’t inflict *ANY* tariffs on the UK. Any tariffs they impose by definition will be inflicted on the EU.

    I don’t understand this presumption of the negotiating of “if you don’t promise not to shoot yourself in the face (force your people to pay more for our goods), we won’t promise not to shoot ourselves in the face (force our people to pay more for your goods)”. The default position that can be achived with two fingers and walking away is “we won’t impose tariffs on stuff we buy from you, and drop to zero all existing tarrifs on stuff we buy from anybody else, what you do is your business”. Any deviation from that puts us in a negative position.

  13. I believe we had to leave once Cameron raised the possibility of a referendum because if we had voted to remain we would have stood up to the EU and blinked.

    After that it would have been open warfare on Britain. They would have gone for our concessions, rebate and any remaining influence we have.

    Remaniacs are under the impression the EU are friends and allies but the commission is showing itself to be just a bully after our money and armed forces.

    Although I think the government are useless and have wasted months on a pointless election they do seem to be getting their act together belatedly.

    All the negotiation is a farce anyway. Whatever the British agree with the EC will have to be ratified by the 27 governments which means Germany and they are having elections at the moment.

  14. If we’d remained in the EU then the next generation of traitors in the Blair / Brown mould would have given away our remaining concessions, negotiated opt-outs and probably taken us into the Eurozone, which would be a magnitude greater error to back out of than the EU alone is.

    By leaving now we take away the power of those future traitors, since I doubt that once we have exited successfully there will be any desire to go through the whole EU accession process again.

    Not that any of this matters anyway because the EU is already crumbling, I still think that an exit of the Visegrád group (Hungary, Poland, Slovakia and the Czech Republic) is likely if BRExit can achieve any reasonable measure of success outside the EU.

    I’ll be surprised if the EU survives in its current form a decade from now.

  15. John Galt

    For the EU to remain viable beyond 10 years requires the Germans to agree to allow other nations to borrow on German credit via Eurobonds. Merkel is a moron and she would like to sign off on it, but the rest of the CDU are not quite that stupid. But, when the next crisis hits, the pressure will be very great.

    The problem will come when the Greeks have fully maxed out the credit card again and expect the Germans to pay. But that could be twenty or more years away. (Greece is very small in economic terms). If it goes to Eurobonds, I fully expect shooting when it falls apart.

  16. Jgh: “The default position that can be achieved with two fingers and walking away is “we won’t impose tariffs on stuff we buy from you, and drop to zero all existing tariffs on stuff we buy from anybody else, what you do is your business”. Any deviation from that puts us in a negative position.”

    That would be great, but do you think it will happen?

  17. @Ken:

    For the EU to remain viable beyond 10 years requires the Germans to agree to allow other nations to borrow on German credit via Eurobonds.

    Indeed, for the EU to move onto the next stage of development of “A country called Europe” requires transfer payments, in essence German taxpayers paying Greek pensions.

    While the majority of Germans remain reluctant to do so and the German treasury continues to pour water on the idea then the nascent EU federal superstate will remain in stasis.

    However it will neither withdraw nor go away, in essence every solution to every crisis will continue to portray transfer payments (subject to whatever caveats) to fix the problem and the Germans will be portrayed as being the barrier to ever greater union.

    Will the EU break first or the Iron will of the Deutsche Bundesbank? It’s the old “irresistible force” paradox in a modern geopolitical setting.

  18. @John Galt

    Which is why the French proposed Eurobonds – because it would disguise the payments being made by the Germans to the Greek pensioners for a decade or two.

    The Germans are happy with ever greater union. The only problem for the rest of the EU is that their vision of the union requires everyone to become German (at least in productivity terms). The French vision is a Europe run by the French and paid for by the Germans. The Southern Europeans just want free money and do not care who runs it.

  19. All that would have to be done is parliament have a vote to scrap Brexit.

    Whether those people would have jobs later is another matter.

    Can well imagine support for UKIP would surge again.

  20. All that would have to be done is parliament have a vote to scrap Brexit.

    Not quite. On the face of it a qualified majority vote of the other EU 27 would also be required to accept withdrawal of the Article 50 notification. I doubt that the EU would lose that vote, but even so, technically more than just scrapping BRExit.

  21. @Ken:

    Which is why the French proposed Eurobonds – because it would disguise the payments being made by the Germans to the Greek pensioners for a decade or two.

    The French can call them knickerbockers if they like, the reality is that they would be primarily funded by the Northern Europeans and transfer payments would go to the Southern Europeans. Everyone understands this, which is why the Eurocrats try to disguise the fact.

    The Germans are happy with ever greater union. The only problem for the rest of the EU is that their vision of the union requires everyone to become German (at least in productivity terms)

    The fundamental problem being that you can’t make the Spaniards into Germans (leastways in productivity terms) any more than you can make Germans into Spaniards. This is why the whole notion of the Federal EU Superstate is flawed, because one thing is not another and cannot be made so by some act of geopolitical alchemy.

  22. This Selmayr needs to be beaten senseless in the street by a group of mysterious “crack addicts” . Who also take a very nice series of photos of him being beaten up. And then send him a “Best Wishes” card made from one such photograph every June 23rd for the rest of his life.

  23. “Lord Murphy O’Tool is in favour of Remain”

    Yes but he’s also in favour of an independent Scotland having its own currency and central bank, so it can print money to its hearts content. And indeed much of his Curajus State stuff would not be possible inside the EU either. So his commitment to the European Dream is dependent on which stump hole he’s looking out of at the time…………

  24. Why can’t they just be honest? Oh yeah – politicians.

    UK – Dear EU, We’ve been a thorn in your side for years preventing you from being a protectionist super state. We’re withdrawing now but expect to keep trade, travel and security arrangements much the same as before.

    EU – Dear UK, We’ve got fat and complacent on your money and with you soaking up our unemployed. If you stop now we’re in a bit of a predicament. Also you’ve called our bluff about the EU only ever getting bigger and the tactics we’ve tried on Greece and other smaller states aren’t working. Please agree to pay us some billions so we don’t lose face.

  25. Dear Mr Worstall

    ” … one of the EU’s most powerful officials said yesterday.

    Martin Selmayr, chief of staff to the European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker, … “

    Selmayr? Who he? When did we vote for him?

    He and his ilk are just one of the many reasons I and others campaigned for years and finally voted Leave.

    There are too many “most powerful officials” in the EU, whose powerful salaries we contribute towards. That’s why we’re leaving and we would be stupid not to*.

    DP

    * Our beloved government™ would rather we didn’t leave, but then what is good for government is not good for the British public and vice versa.

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