He’s got a point here

There has been international outcry after reports that Donald Trump described Haiti, El Salvador and some African nations as “shithole countries” in a meeting with US lawmakers on Thursday.

Some places are shitholes, others aren’t. Quite why this is causing so much pearl clutching is unknown.

53 thoughts on “He’s got a point here”

  1. So Much For Subtlety

    Haitians were prominent among the early AIDS victims because it turns out that Haiti was a popular place for American homosexuals to go as sex tourists.

    When your country is noted for prostituting its young men, it is a sh!thole.

    I have to say I assume Trump has been listening to me because I have been using the term for a long time. Is that too immodest? I hope so. Anyway, it did not occur to me that it was racist. Offensive? Sure. But racist? Haiti is a sh!thole. Any country that everyone tries to flee and no one moves to is a sh!thole. Africa would be empty the day after tomorrow if the US opened its doors.

  2. Trump actually is a bit of a genius at stirring and trolling stupid progressives.

    We are supposed to pretend that all countries are equally desirable places to live with exactly equivalent populations, some of whom (through no fault of their own), have had a strange run of bad luck since forever; probably it is due to evil capitalism, “unfettered” free markets, or whatever.

    By highlighting the laughable nature of the lefty world view and exposing the faux outrage whenever he pushes the wrong button, Trump does the world a great service.

  3. So Much For Subtlety

    If he keeps this up, how can he not be reelected in a landslide?

    Sad to see Mia Love taking offense. I liked her.

  4. Richard Murphy can think of “nothing worse” than visiting the Far East. Where’s the outrage?

    Dr. Keith Crainshraw says:
    June 29 2017 at 10:12 am
    Nothing against Wales, but you should treat the wife and kids to something long haul, relaxing but also exciting, relaxing or educational (even on the political side!). The Far East is good for that, try touring Cambodia, Vietnam, Thailand, Myanmar. 2 weeks out of the year no-one will be begrudge you and it’s enlightening.

    Richard Murphy says:
    June 29 2017 at 10:41 am
    I can think of nothing worse!

    Give me some steam trains, good walks and the Irish Sea

    The boys agree

  5. As TimN points out over at his place, East Germany was a shithole. Most of Eastern Europe still is. Russia always has been. Italy largely is too. Never been to Portugal or Spain so couldn’t comment. On a smaller scale, most of Oxford is too, outside the picturesque centre.

  6. There are plenty of shitholes in the USA, and Trump found a fair few voters in them (as did Hillary, natch). I’ll credit him for telling it like it is when he really does. But if he’s just slagging of forrins to amuse racists, then fuck him.

    The man is a cunt. Even if he does annoy lots of other cunts, He’s still a cunt. Anyone enjoying this show forfeits any right to slag off politicians because if you’re ok with Trump as the most powerful politician on the planet you’re ok with anything.

    He won fair and square. But he’s still a cunt.

  7. TTG
    I put it to you that cunt is a MUCH naughtier word than shithole. So you are alot naughtier / cuntier than Trump. The Cunto Di Tutti Cunti in fact.

  8. Only here could you see this discussion on the correctness of “The Cunto Di Tutti Cunti ” vs “la Cunta di Tutte le Cunte “

  9. Philip Scott Thomas

    ….Trump as the most powerful politician on the planet…

    God, I get tired of hearing people trot that old line out. He’s not, not by a long shot.

  10. @ Philip Scott Thomas

    Yeah, you’re right actually. Fair comment.

    He’s still a massive cunt, though.

  11. I overheard two Essex college ‘workers’ discussing this on the train going into work, and laughing about how ‘those Americans must be regretting electing him now’.

    Utterly clueless. It’s probably won him more votes.

  12. Richard Murphy says:
    June 29 2017 at 10:41 am
    I can think of nothing worse!

    Not a Professor Dick Tater obviously prefers his holidays in Dachau not some country full of fuzzy wuzzies or slopes.

  13. Shithole countries…….I have seen a good few that I would almost describe as shithole countries or at least undesirable but cruise companies call them exotic destinations.

    Jamacia…for one, don’t like the fuckers who live there and its no surprise that the government have built a fancy shopping area at Falmouth port to keep tourists from the local market for fear of getting mugged.

  14. So Much For Subtlety

    The Thought Gang – “Anyone enjoying this show forfeits any right to slag off politicians because if you’re ok with Trump as the most powerful politician on the planet you’re ok with anything.”

    He hasn’t eaten anyone. Which you cannot say about every foreign leader – not all of them from Africa. He hasn’t had a single journalist killed. Unlike Putin and pretty much all the Third World capable of organising it. He has not murdered political opponents overseas. Unlike Putin and his pals again. He has not engaged in slavery. He is not ethnically cleansing anyone.

    By what possible measure it is forbidden to say the US is not a sh!thole like so many other places and hence that it is still reasonable to criticise other places no matter what Trump says?

    By the way, eating, blowing up, irradiating, torturing or otherwise mistreating political opponents is a good sign that a country is a sh!thole. The US is not a sh!thole.

  15. @Julia.

    Trump will win easliy next time….economy booming and a world first for a politician who says it and then does it.

  16. The man is a cunt. Even if he does annoy lots of other cunts, He’s still a cunt.

    He had to be, or he’d not have won. Jeb Bush is a pretty decent fellow, he got 3% of the vote. Mitt Romney was decent as well, and the media called him a Nazi and when he started apologising, everyone believed it.

    Anyway, one of the amusing things is watching the reaction of African students to Trump’s remarks. If you are an African and studying in America there is a very good chance your family had the political clout and connections to first educate you, and then get you to America. In other words, these people are part of the establishment classes back home and benefiting from that status, i.e. part of the very reason these countries are shitholes.

  17. So Much For Subtlety

    Noel Scoper – “Richard Murphy can think of “nothing worse” than visiting the Far East. Where’s the outrage?”

    It is ironic because East Asia is one of the few places that still has working steam engines. He could ride them to his heart’s content. Better yet he could travel on Cambodia’s bamboo railway (which only exists for foreign tourists so he better be fast before they close it.)

    Rickie – “Jamacia…for one, don’t like the fuckers who live there and its no surprise that the government have built a fancy shopping area at Falmouth port to keep tourists from the local market for fear of getting mugged.”

    I have said before that the common view of Jamaicans is so at variance with reality. It is remarkable. I mean you get a shock when you go to Germany and you realise they really are like that, but the Happy, Cheerful Jamaican quasi-Rasta exists only in the mind of delusional Western liberals from what I can see. A Jamaican has just been caught spraying people with acid. Another lovely gift from the sunny Caribbean. He said he didn’t realise it hurt.


  18. So Much For Subtlety

    Just in passing, Wikipedia is terribly politically correct these days, but I do like their efforts at putting lipstick on a pig:


    A shorter article would say that apart from the partly White people in the North and the entirely White people in the South, African architecture consists of imaginatively stacked heaps of cow sh!t.

    As for Central America, I find Hornblower to be the best guide to the region.

  19. You can’t blame individuals for wanting to leave their shitholes. You can’t all that easily blame individuals for the shitty state of their countries. You can blame whole societies for their shittiness.
    Most of all I haven’t heard any convincing arguments why better cultures, better societies have any obligation to accept the refugees of the shitty ones.
    And, most controversially, our oversight of some shitholes as colonial overlords made them alot less shitty. If we’re not allowed to run the shitholes then we shouldn’t be asked to pay for their failure now.

  20. @SMFS

    I said “parts” of the USA.

    As for other political cunts out there. Sure. And Trump hasn’t done things others have. Or has, but nobody knows because US Presidents always do it and don’t get caught.

    Despite is bluster, he has not started a war. And I don’t think he will. Which is good.

    But my point was more about all the dim centrists who get pasted here. And even the father-to-the-lefts. And Hillary. Etc. If people are ok with a president who spouts persistent bullshit, incites hatred, and places his own ego above all things, then those people are on shakey ground slagging off Ed Balls.

  21. But Ed Balls is a deeply evil man who did a large amount of damage to the UK.

    By comparison Trump is not in his league. You seem to be objecting to the fact that he trolls progressives and makes them look stupid? I would say that is a good thing. You can’t be reminded of it too many times.

  22. TTG
    What bullshit does Trump persistently spout? He says what he thinks and you make not like it – but actual, factually incorrect lies? What?
    What hatred has he incited? He has slowed the inbound flow from countries with major security issues. Which is broadly popular. Could you cite a single actual incitement?
    Ego? Yup. But not even in Obama’s league.

  23. Haha. He’s literally just said he cancelled his uk visit because he didn’t want to open the new embassy, with some (inaccurate) Obama baiting thrown in.

    I’m of the view that political leaders shouldn’t endlessly troll huge swathes of their populations. But ymmv.

  24. Solid Steve 2: Squirrels of The Patriots

    Eh. Like Fox Mulder, I want to believe, but remember this claim comes from Jeff Bezos Blog based on anonymous sources.


    Trump then suggested that the United States should instead bring more people from countries such as Norway, whose prime minister he met with Wednesday. The president, according to a White House official, also suggested he would be open to more immigrants from Asian countries because he felt they help the United States economically.

    It’s so crazy it might just work.

  25. Reposted from Tim N’s spot.

    People often do use stereotypes about a country (often true ones) to jump to unfair conclusions about an individual from or with connections to that country, sadly. And Trump’s statement is pretty much tautological – one way of measuring how crummy a country is, is how keen its inhabitants are to scram outta there. Which is why West Germany didn’t need to build a wall to stop its population fleeing en masse eastwards.

    I was very amused by this though – from BBC news, three “related stories” that appear right next to each other:

    Full article Trump ‘in crude outburst about migrants’

    Africa Live: Africans mock Trump over vulgar slur, protests in cholera-hit Zambia

    Africa Live: Gabon lifts presidential term limits, Sudan professor ‘hits females’

    Could it even be that Trump gets his negatively skewed view of Africa by being an avid reader of the Beeb?

  26. Solid Steve 2: Squirrels of The Patriots

    TTG – He’s literally just said he cancelled his uk visit because he didn’t want to open the new embassy

    Thank God.

    I’m a yuge Trump fan, but him visiting the UK would be horribly embarrassing… for us. Every fat feminist heffalump, crusy tie-dyed enviro-weirdo, genderspazzed he/she and dress-wearing Moon God cultist would be out screaming at his motorcade.

    It’s bad enough that the FFC seems to be going out of her way to antagonise our greatest ally, at a time when we need friends.

  27. “@David Milliband. : Trump Administration leading a race to the bottom on refugees and immigrants that is a betrayal of America’s future,…”

    huh? race to the bottom?

    The trumpian point is that quality of the country affects the quality of the immigrant and the quality of the immigrant affect the benefits enjoyed by Americans of said immigration.

    Whilst the Trumpian point can be countered in that you can to a large extent control policy for the quality of legal immigrants without recourse to the shittiness of their homeland, note that Milliband wants not to have to justify the benefits to america. He’s saying don’t go there, don’t go judging policies on the benefits enjoyed by america. Once we’re down there everyone will have follow suit or they won’t get elected.

  28. I have a theory, Greater shithole theory, which states that people from a shithole will move to a lesser shithole as long as their own is worse. But their presence brings with it elements of shithole which make the new place worse. They will keep moving as long as they come from a greater shithole. That is until they make the new place equally shitty. Obviousology, you might say, but there are many to whom it doesn’t appear to be obvious..

  29. Interestingly, the same people outraged at Trump’s remarks are also against deporting Salvadoran illegal aliens back to their home country. Because El Salvador is such a shithole that it would cruel to make someone go back there.

  30. @So Much For Subtlety

    Spot on with your Jamacia view….never have I witnessed such rude aggressive nasty bastards, and when they are in large numbers they let it be known they hate tourists.

    Cruise companies must be get some serious incentives to call at Jamacia…cos the staff on cruise ships know the score, regular passengers know all about the bastards, infact not getting off the ship at the port is common.

    Bob Marley “tea towels in gift shops for £15 , one love, no worries, no problems, yeah mon” its all a big con job.

    Within 10 minutes of my first visit there….the cunts were not getting any of my money.

  31. Solid Steve 2: Squirrels of The Patriots

    JuliaM – I know right?

    “Sven, we have all this oil money, what shall we do with it all?

    “I know, Roald! Let’s turn our country into frozen Africa!”

  32. Attitudes as expressed by TTG are exactly what are required to ensure that Trump gets a second and probably a third term. Keep up the good work.

  33. They present no evidence that they AREN’T SHITHOLES.

    “The truth is incontrovertible, malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end; there it is.” -Winston Churchill

  34. Dammit, Trumps not coming. Whatever am I going to do with a job lot of fluffy vulva-shaped hats now?

    Pussy hats are no longer woke enough for progressives. They aren’t inclusive enough for trans and non-binaries to feel safe.

    Parody is dead.

  35. Trump’s tendency for loose talk is well-known and unremarkable. Conceding that residents of shithole nations are not necessarily shithole people, Trump’s instinct is good and his position here has been unwavering: Immigration policy should be set based on identifying individuals whose in-migration will benefit the nation. Not on making politicians look good. Not on reunifying possibly dysfunctional families. And above all, not on a lottery that conveys that we had not admitted enough of your kind before, because we are so racist–a system that invites the winner never to assimilate.

    David Brooks in the New York Times wrote recently that lefties are turning themselves into caricatures, a few days before American lefties read false racism into Trump’s wisecrack, and before this latest one came here to call Trump a cunt.

  36. Shitty people make shitty countries. Haiti is a shithole, most African countries are shitholes, Central America is more or less 100% shithole and most of South America, excepting parts of Chile and Argentina, is too.

    It’s certainly true that some psrts of America are shitholes, but mostly those inhabited by large numbers of people who originate from Africa and Central America. Weird coincidence eh?

  37. Bloke in Costa Rica

    The number of shithole countries is huge. I don’t live in one, but the neighbouring country to the north is a shithole. I have been there. It is cracked, worn-out, depressed. The average person there makes in a year what I make in about ten days, and I’m not wealthy. It requires some pretty strenuous contortions to argue that it is not a shithole. It is less shitholey than Venezuela, but that’s a low bar.

    Haiti is so objectively a shithole that you can see it from space.

  38. Jonathon,

    I don’t think most of central America is a shithole, it is merely poor.

    Mexicans mostly have food, clothing and peace. Their obesity suggests they are not living on the edge. Quite a lot of illegal immigrants to the US actually return to Mexico. It’s not that bad a country if you have money and are not living in the gang-controlled parts (which is actually most of it). Chile is quite lovely if you are wealthy. I’ve met quite a lot of Chileans, and they would add more to a country as immigrants than most Glaswegians or Detroiters.

    Haiti, Jamaica, Venezuela and most of Africa are different. They are MUCH poorer for a start. But more than that, they are dangerous, with street level, gang and political crime rife. Their countries can’t prevent disease. Their economies break down and stuff is unavailable (corruption being a large part). People leaving them don’t go back.

    Fair enough you might not want to live in Chile or Mexico, but they’re better than Portugal only 30 years ago. To call them “shitholes” is to make the term merely mean “not as rich as I like”.

  39. Sorry, to make myself clear, most of Mexico is not gang controlled. The far North and Acapulco are not representative of a large country, any more than Baltimore and the like are representative of the US.

  40. I have been to Mexico City. I was struck by how completely middle class it is.

    If you want to see fat Mexicans, go to southern Texas.

    Haiti was struck by a major earth quake a few years ago. The U.S. and many others in the world poured money in to help them. The Clintons got there quick, and set themselves up to manage the relief. Haiti is still a shithole.
    Just a coincidence.

  41. @Chester Draws:

    “I don’t think most of central America is a shithole, it is merely poor.”

    ” It’s not that bad a country if you have money and are not living in the gang-controlled parts (which is actually most of it). ”

    Chester, I’m sure there are great parts of Mexico just as there are great parts of Sub-Saharan Africa, but in general I’d class it as a shithole i.e somewhere I wouldn’t choose to live.

    BTW, I hear that Uruguay is quite nice.

  42. As a diversion: if the UK was a republic and had US type presidential elections, barring the political class (yes, Farage too, dirty hypocrite), who would make a good president and statesmen on a global stage?

    To take the obvious comparison, Alan Sugar?

  43. H’angus the Monkey

    Give the British public a chance to elect a comedy candidate for a comedy job, they’ll take it.

  44. I don’t think most of central America is a shithole, it is merely poor.

    Poor and crime-ridden. El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras and Belize all have murder rates above 30 per 100,000 residents, which is really, really bad.

  45. H’angus did a pretty reasonable job for Hartlepool – certainly compared with the ‘achievements’ of other, more political mayors. First UK mayor to win three terms. The post (sadly for the gaiety of nations) has now been abolished by another referendum.

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