This is actually possible

The “Little Ice Age” of the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries was triggered by the genocide of indigenous people in the Americas by European settlers, new research shows.

Scientists have long wondered what caused the drop in temperatures so severe it sometimes caused the River Thames to freeze over.

Now, new analysis by University College London (UCL) argues that so many people were slaughtered or died of disease that the amount of agricultural land dramatically reduced, in turn sucking carbon dioxide (CO²) from the atmosphere.

Known as the “Great Dying”, the upheavals following the first contact with Europeans in 1492 is thought to have slashed the population of 60 million living across the…

Whether it’s true or not is another matter. Can’t say I’m entirely sold on it. For I’m pretty sure that we generally start it off, the little ice age, before 1492.

However, entirely willing to believe it contributed…..

34 thoughts on “This is actually possible”

  1. New analysis = code for no proof, just wish fulfilment.

    Sounds to me like a new ploy for the socialists to prove how wicked we all are.

    And anyway, the number is significantly less than Stalin managed with no known atmospheric effect apart from the smell.

    More laughs will be provided by their ANALYSIS of the population in the affected areas and the number of deaths

  2. The thirteenth century was a bit of a catastrophe after the warmer than now Medieval Warm Period leading to crop failure famine and plague. (Also cannibalism among the Puebla North Americans) Maybe that can be blamed on the Vikings? The big freeze in the sixth century driving driving barbarian hordes across the frozen Danube (and the simultaneous collapse of MesoAmerican cities to be swallowed by jungle) proves Basque fishermen reached North America.The end of the Bronze Age civilisations? Must be whitey. Nothing to do with the sun, absolutely nothing…

  3. Do they say what the climatic “footprint” of the Black Death was? Surely more people died in that episode than were living in the parts of the New World affected by this so-called “genocide”

  4. There seems to be disagreement over whether the Little Ice Age started in 1645 or 1300. Also, according to Wikipedia, some people believe it was caused by deforestation, stemming from an increase in human population. Much conjecture here…

    Also, if a fall in population of 50-60m can cause a little ice age, surely the 500m people added to the world population between 1750 and 1850 would have caused substantial warming?

    Wikipedia also tells me the little ice age involved a 1 degree rise in average temperature. If a population drop of 60m caused that then we were damn lucky to get away with a rise of only 0.6 degrees in the 20th century, with more than 3bn people added.

    So it is all an utter crock then; no surprise that the Terriblegraph reported it.

  5. I am pretty sure that the only period during which the world`s population overall actually went down was during the first black death so this seems a bit makey uppy to me.( and a bit white-European-hair-shirt as well)
    Another problem is that if that sort of small number made a difference then why are we not boiling alive now ?
    There are more people alive today than have ever died ( its not even close), the worlds population in the so called little ice age was weeny by comparison so how can it have mattered so much then and not at all now.
    Volcanic activity ( in the Library with the candlestick )is my culprit and my evidence is that we pretty much know that a huge eruption in the 19th century caused all those Dickensian snowy Winters
    I wouldn`t start taking an interest in science if I were you , you `ll have to start admitting that man mad global warming is fact – wrap up in a nice warm blanket of ignorance …its toasty warm in there mmmmmmmmmmmmmm

  6. The actual paper seems rather better. Lots of “contributed to” and the like. And yes, saying that the Black Death was part of it too.

    As to titchy populations etc. Yes, but agriculture was grossly inefficient back then. Needed vast acreages. A decline ni population would have – did with the BD – to vast acreages returning to forest.

    “A contribution” stands up I think. How much? Well…..

  7. Doesn’t make sense.
    Land area is vegetated with either wild or cultivated plant life. So what would be the difference in CO2 uptake or release?
    Assume that native slash and burn agriculture contributed as much CO2 as it took out. (like most assumptions probably a bad one.)
    Did hunter gatherer societies have sufficient land under cultivation to make a difference?
    Don’t think there’s a real linkage there.

  8. According to Professor Man and his team, who’s work was verified and promoted by the IPCC, there was no medieval warm period nor little ice age and the recent warming is unprecedented.
    This paper undermines the settled science and calls into question the veracity of papers produced by Professor Mann et. al. as well as that of the IPCC.

  9. Does the question of more alive now vs ever lived not depend wholly on when you start the counting? At what point did we count as human? I think all paleoontological evidence suggests we should start counting ourselves as modern humans some time between 2 and 3 million years ago. So 100% more dead than alive.
    (p.s. this means that the human species is older than the rings of Saturn!)

  10. And the really clever bit is how this caused a total lack of sunspots. /s
    There has long been known a correlation between the sunspot count and global climate, for a long time no plausible connection existed. Recently an explanation has been offered, though how it would be proved…
    But the sun driving the Earth’s climate seems a lot more plausible than the Earth’s climate driving the sun.
    Interestingly, we are in a period of no sunspots again.

  11. Narrative, innit.

    The LIA is highly inconvenient to the global warming cult, so now they’re blaming it on racism.

  12. Facepainter–stick to kissing the EU’s arse. You have already proved yourself an arrogant buffoon in terms of culture. No need to complete the set by showing you are a scientific ignoramus as well. You tick all the boxes for well-off London Bubble WOMI trash–pig-shit thick, arrogant, entitled, thinks self so-superior to all those plebs. You are the scum de la scum indeed.

  13. This is SJW catnip. Climate Change and Colonisation in one, grand unified theory! Double compo to organised identity groups.

  14. Newmania says – Another problem is that if that sort of small number made a difference then why are we not boiling alive now ?

    Yarp. If the story is that the deaths of several million (mostly nomadic hunter-gatherers and pre-industrial subsistence farmers) caused global climate change… you’d think WW2, Stalin’s famines, and the Chinese Holocaust might’ve similarly affected the weather.

    Maybe it did. But I suspect not. This has the air of #woke science about it, similar to feminist theoreticians “proving” that the hole in the ozone layer was caused by rape.

  15. Slightly off topic, anyone know if the Spaniards are being pursued for squillions as compo for the various genocides in Sth America?

  16. anyone know if the Spaniards are being pursued for squillions as compo for the various genocides in Sth America

    I don’t know, but most people in S. America have some European blood don’t they? They’d have to compensate themselves, or just ship bales of cash to confused tribes in the Amazon.

    Also, does it count as genocide if it was mostly due to people sneezing?

  17. The message I got from this is that modern CO2-fuel global warming can only be addressed through the elimination of large swathes of human population.

  18. Newmania
    “There are more people alive today than have ever died ( its not even close), ”

    Absolute tosh.

    The UN, for what thwy are worth, estimates the ‘ever lived’ population to be 108 billion.

  19. ‘This is actually possible’

    Sure, if you believe Man controls, or even affects, the weather.

    That is to say, if you are whacky.

  20. The “Little Ice Age” of the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries was triggered by the genocide of indigenous people in the Americas by European settlers, new research shows.

    A twofer for guilt tripping on Evil White People!

    Genocide in the Americas. Climate change.


  21. If you think a bit more it gets even better. If the crops being grown on the farmland (big assumption 1) were not replaced by an equal amount of weeds or trees or bushes or something (big assumption 2) then whitey must have ploughed the land with salt or something, which means that whitey made it even worse (self-evident truth)

  22. Quite so, Diogenes
    Grassland absorbs more CO2 than mature forest.
    Secondary growth and coppicing absorbs the most.

    However, if European invaders chopped down forests and decimated the tribes, then you would get a lot of secondary growth, more CO2 absorption and so, theoretically a cooling effect.
    Trouble is, there is scant evidence for a worldwide drop in atmospheric CO2 for the period under review.

  23. Bloke no Longer in Austria

    HughThomas in his Conquest of Mexico outlines some of the cntroversies about the population in Central America.

    Some historians and statitcians maintain that regional population was as high as 25-30 million before the Spaniards arrived. Thomas reckons that a more feasible number is 8-9millionish, based on a study that suggested that the cultivated land could support a maximum of ten millions. Tenochtitlan had a population of 250-500,000 and its immediate hinterland half to one million.
    By the 1560s the estimated population of Mexico was 2.5 millions. He believes that the upper classes were worst thit as they had most interaction with he Spaniards.

    Much of the agricultural land was maintained and improved upon with the introduction of animals and steel tools, oh and the wheel, of course.

  24. @Patrick February 1, 2019 at 10:36 am

    Depends how one defines “modern humans”

    Homo Sapiens ~300,000 years
    Homo “out of africa” Sapiens – us – is ~160,000 years

    A mere blink in time compared to Dinosaurs rule of 160-200 Million years

  25. The 108bn number goes back 52k years. So 6% of all the people who have lived over the last, say, 1000 life times are currently alive.

  26. The authors have assembled a lot of estimates of pre-Columbus populations and have chosen not toweightthem according to quality so their estimates of deaths in a minority of the area of the Americas is 90% of the total population of the whole of the Americas.

    Good starting point!

    The small areas that converted from growing crops to forest are deemed to have altered the CO2 balance of the whole planet in a couple of decades and then ceased to have any effect.

  27. I’m too lazy to read the original. Do they mention the genocide of indigenous Americans by other indigenous Americans? At the time the European settlers arrived, the nomadic nations of North America were already experiencing severe population pressure owing to their nomadic lifestyles which were highly inefficient at exploitation of the land. As soon as one area was exhausted they moved on.

    From Quora: David Grason, former Owner/Operator (1990-2010)
    Answered May 16, 2017 · Upvoted by Alexander Shmidke, Master Political Science & History, Saint-Petersburg State University (2008) and Yao Zhan, Masters History, La Trobe University (1997)

    As a Native-American, I feel I’m somewhat qualified to provide an answer that would not really sit all that well with my tribal brethren. But I’m going to say it anyway because it is the damn truth!

    The white man has always been condemned for his brutal treatment of the Native-Americans. The white man came here and conquered the indigenous peoples and then took their land. BUT HELL! That’s exactly the same thing all the native tribes were doing to each other anyway. The white man has never broken any established rules. Rather, he just did the same thing they had all been doing for thousands of years. Now, everyone is just pissed off because the white man was the strongest warrior. They criminalize the white man and label him a racist because of simple, plain old sour grapes.

  28. White guilt applied to Indians.

    The Apache and Navajo were notorious for their constant warfare.

    ‘Sioux’ is Blackfoot and Crow for ‘enemy.’

    ‘Climate change’ is white guilt applied to weather. Ridiculous on two levels.

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