But it is Honey

The BBC’s misguided response suggests that reacting to racism is worse than racism itself. All I saw was another woman of colour calling out racist remarks for what they were, and describing her own experiences. The clear message sent by this ruling is that whether or not something is racist is purely subjective.

To complain about Europeans gong to South Africa to dispossess the indigenes is to be right on, just and laudable. To complain about Bantus from West Africa doing the same is to be appallingly racist.

Racism is thus subjective, isn’t it?

Any approach to impartiality needs to clearly acknowledge that racism – particularly of the blatant “go home” variety – is a violent and illegitimate standpoint.

By whose standards then? By those you wish to impose on everyone presumably. At which point you can fuck off Honey.

Because it’s not called racism when someone says the descendants of the Voortrekkers “should go home” but it is when second generation immigrants here are told to do so? Subjectivity rather depends upon your point of view, doesn’t it?

35 thoughts on “But it is Honey”

  1. “Journalism 101 tells us that if someone says it’s drizzling outside, and another that it’s dry, the job of the journalist is not to quote both but to find out which is true.”

    Given you all failed so miserably at that when someone told you diversity was wonderful and others told you actually, no, there’s a problem with Pakistani grooming gangs, why the hell should I suddenly care now?

  2. The idea of a black or coloured people is, of course, a European one itself. To Africans there were just ‘people’, until they became part of the Euro-centric world ( a world that I am current seeking to defend against the barbarians who wish to return to tribal ignorance )
    The question of the inhumanity of White South Africans , was rather interesting at the time. Much of Africa was run along tribal lines with one tribe frequently vilely oppressing another .The problem was essentially that we expected better of the white people,…much the same seems to happened when discussing the long involvement of black people in enslaving other black people.
    Having said all that I have always thought Free speech was a bourgeois delusion. Speech affects action the two are not separate other than to Prep school debaters
    You say people should be on the telly saying blacks should go home . I find the thought and the Policy of repatriation repugnant and do not feel we need to provide such ideas with a platform .
    Every society has to negotiate with its values as Golda Meir once said ( before sending an assassin to off some PLO bomber probably )

    We value free speech true but setting limits is should not be illiberally forbidden either

  3. JuliaM +1

    Newmania – I find the thought and the Policy of repatriation repugnant and do not feel we need to provide such ideas with a platform

    Yet you were crying like a little bitch when Sir John Redwood didn’t approve every single one of your tedious Euromaniacal spam messages to be published on his personal blog.

    It’s like ten thousand spoons, innit?

  4. I found a long time ago that the best response to accusations of racism is smile at the accuser & say “Yes, I’m quite comfortable with that. So, otherwise, what exactly’s your point?”
    Enormously amusing watching the result.

  5. Yet you were crying like a little bitch when Sir John Redwood didn’t approve every single one of your tedious Euromaniacal spam messages to be published on his personal blog.

    If by”crying like a little bitch” you mean , objecting to him presenting his blog as open for discussion and then censoring one side , then you have a point , albeit that you are a boring cunt

    toodles

  6. [A euro-centric] world that I am current seeking to defend against the barbarians who wish to return to tribal ignorance

    It’s jolly hard work having a calling to be a warrior in the cause of righteousness.

    Today it’s barbarians, yesterday it was
    retired and incontinent English parasites
    who will have died off.

    So much love.

  7. The problem was essentially that we expected better of the white people,

    Not so much white people as English people, everyone else is a wog.

  8. @Newmania “The idea of a black or coloured people is, of course, a European one itself. To Africans there were just ‘people’”

    ho ho ho.

    Because some of those Africans were enslaving other Africans for centuries before Europeans got involved. Slavery was quite popular among the ancient Egyptians who enslaved foreigners captured in wars. That was from around at least as far back as 1500 BC. Given that northern Africans are much lighter skinned than those further south in Africa it’s a fair bet that the slaves were much darker than their masters. But I guess the Egyptians didn’t notice the skin colour difference and made no inferences from it.

    “is it just me or is there a marked difference in skin tone between us and those we conquer and enslave?”

    “Blimey, I’d never really thought about it but now that you mention it, what an odd co-incidence”

    You just start from ‘white man bad’ and then hammer all facts into an unrecognisable mess until they fit with your beliefs.

  9. @Newmania “We value free speech true but setting limits is should not be illiberally forbidden either”

    And of course, it’s you self-proclaimed liberals with by your holy blessing of ‘the truth’ who must decide what those limits are.

  10. If by”crying like a little bitch” you mean , objecting to him presenting his blog as open for discussion and then censoring one side ,

    So only publishing most of your deranged comments on a premoderated blog is “censorship” and bad, whereas silencing people who disagree with Newmania is “setting limits” and good.

    albeit that you are a boring cunt

    That’s not what your Mum said.

  11. ‘a world that I am current seeking to defend against the barbarians who wish to return to tribal ignorance )’

    Please may I have some of whatever you have consumed as I’d like to experience the same hallucinations?

  12. Steve

    ‘That’s not what your Mum said’

    Arguably your greatest ever comment even against Stiff competition – a fitting riposte to the ‘New Remainiac’ albeit his first post arguably reveals he’s writing under the influence of a hitherto unknown hallucinogenic substance

  13. BTW

    All I saw was another woman of colour calling out racist remarks for what they were

    What Trump actually said was that if you hate America, you’re free to piss off back to your own shithole countries. (I’m paraphrasing)

    That’s not racist in the slightest, it’s nothing Prime Minister Modi or President Alvi or any other World Leader of Colour wouldn’t also say about troublesome recent arrivals in their countries.

    But it’s interesting the BBC “woman of colour” was immediately triggered.

  14. VP – thanks, my wife says I’m immature but I told her “why are you SO UNFAIR?!?” and stormed into my room to play Chuckie Egg

  15. @Steve

    ‘What Trump actually said was that if you hate America, you’re free to piss off back to your own shithole countries. (I’m paraphrasing)’

    He didn’t ecven say that, as far as I remember. He said something to the effect of if you hate America, you’re free to piss off back to your own shithole countries, fix them, then come back and tell us how you did it.

    In what kind of purple-skied universe is that racist? He wants to get these experts to help improve the lot of poor people in dodgy places, given that it’s apparently so easy, that’s all.

    ‘Micha Frazer-Carroll is opinions editor at gal-dem.com’

    Yep I bet she is.

  16. “Journalism 101 tells us that if someone says it’s drizzling outside, and another that it’s dry, the job of the journalist is not to quote both but to find out which is true.”

    This is the romantic fiction all journalists, especially the loony and Progressive ones, tell themselves, but it is balls, demonstrable bollocks.

    For the modern journalist “Journalism 101” tells them to track down the person saying it is dry when it is dry, and mercilessly attack, pillory and delegitimise them until they are driven out of public life. Then join in the chant that it’s raining, and only bigots and deniers say otherwise.

  17. Steve–must have been Facepainters middle class selfish Me,Me,Me evil stepmother that you shagged. He didn’t have a Mother–they found him in a dustbin behind Traitors Anonymous”.

    “My name is Facepainter and I’m a scummy traitor”.

    If repatriation worries you Face–worry about your own trans-shipping to your precious EU. In an ice-cream van converted to be amphibious in the manner of Top Gear.

    Won’t your EU masters be pleased to see you coming. Esp as all the jobs for arrogant selfish cunts already have a 100 year waiting list. Another victim of yoof unemployment you will be.

  18. ‘That’s not what your Mum said’

    In a similar vein…..

    “Have you ever [insert grotesque and far-fetched sexual practices of your choosing] with your wife?”

    “no”

    “Oh, you should do, she loves it”

  19. Wag 1*:Wish my van was as dirty as this

    [scrawled into the grime on the back panel]

    Wage 2: Oh, she is

    [scrawled below]

    * Not in the Yardie sense

  20. So a government policy to assist refugees to return to their homeland once the threat/danger that caused them to leave has passed is now racist.

  21. From what I read the BBC didn’t criticise the content of what she said just that the shouldn’t have said it in that setting as it breached the editorial guidelines for the show.
    All told a very technical infringement that they haven’t even punished anyone for so the fuss seems entirely over the top as usual.
    Compare how long anything Trump does lingers in the media with how quickly the whole Trudeau blackface stuff has blown over.

  22. How deliciously Orwellian:

    “We value free speech true but setting limits is should not be illiberally forbidden either”

  23. Gamecock

    My thoughts exactly – although the sentence seems to need to be run through a grammar checker.

    Steve

    I often do the same but normally Jetpac rather than Chuckie Eggg

  24. “I found a long time ago that the best response to accusations of racism is smile at the accuser & say ‘Yes, I’m quite comfortable with that. So, otherwise, what exactly’s your point?’
    Enormously amusing watching the result.”

    Mr in Spain, I always think of Lord and Lady Whiteadder whenever I hear someone say, “Dass racist!” = “wicked child!”

    Like me, you seem to spend a lot of time among people from slightly less benighted parts of the world than here or, Gawd help us, Marbella, and they’re generally quite relaxed about this stuff. Rather like little caramel-coloured Jim Davidson’s, they are. The first time I saw it, donkey’s years ago, I experienced momentary cognitive dissonance. On the one hand, here was a likeable chap, never did anyone any harm, bit dull, but decent. On the other hand, an anti-semite.

    I rapidly concluded his anti-semitism was one part of the whole, by no means a large part of it and his basic decency outweighed the expression of a mere opinion. Which, I equally rapidly concluded, was of a piece with rubbing along with all the metropolitan socialists and communists I’ve had to live with, it seems like, forever.

    The “Racist!” screech so often fails to distinguish words/thoughts, from deeds.

    But like you, I’ve concluded I am a racist, and I’m relaxed about it. I tend to prefer dusky minxes, for one thing. And if you put a gun to my head and told me I had to place a bet in a 100 metre running race between one of two men, one of whom was a paleface and the other was called Desmond Bingo, I’d place it on DB.

    Of course, it might turn out that DB was a nonagenarian with one leg, and paleface a 19 year-old gazelle. But if I knew no more than one is apparently black and one is white, I’d choose the black chap.

    And from there, whole worlds of honest appreciation open up. Differences in intellect, for instance. Propensity to violence, for another.

    On a wholly separate topic, I voted to Leave mainly because since the Danish referendum in 1992 I’ve seen the EU as an obviously dangerous powder keg determined to crush national self-determination (that’s for you, Newmania: I’m a racist who voted for non racist reasons to leave the EU. Complicated, what, this business of knowing what motivates everyone?).

  25. “. . . whether or not something is racist is purely subjective.”

    A friend of mine was at dinner with his kids the other day. The two oldest are just out of college. In a Chinese restaurant he asked for something by name and the kids were mortified that he dared speak Chinese to a Chinese waiter in a Chinese restaurant – not even speak Chinese, just name the item he wanted – because ‘that’s racists’.

    Apparently the accepted behavior among the young set is to assume the waiter doesn’t speak English and just point at the menu.

    And they wonder why we don’t take their protestations seriously. By Christ, were we that bad when we were that age?

  26. “Newmania
    September 27, 2019 at 10:13 am

    The idea of a black or coloured people is, of course, a European one itself. To Africans there were just ‘people’, ”

    So, how do you explain the African genocides and slavery economy that existed prior to the Europeans showing up?

    Is it that you’re saying African are uniquely horrible because they were willing to murder and enslave whole towns despite considering them people – whereas Europeans at least had to dehumanize them before engaging in such behavior?

  27. Agammamon, there’s a great British tradition, when speaking to furriners, to try first in English. Then, when they don’t understand, we say the same thing, but in a raised voice.

    It’s enormously helpful to all concerned.

  28. @Agammamon September 27, 2019 at 6:45 pm

    Point at menu is a new one for me

    @Mr Lud September 27, 2019 at 6:49 pm

    Yep. I assume furriners can speak English. If one shop/cafe doesn’t I go to another

    .
    On illiberal liberals, seems Uni’s are introducing mandatory Climate Change awareness courses and schools and Uni dining rooms only serving vegan food

    Madness

  29. Animosity between, say, Hutu and Tutsi who are all just people has nothing to do with race, tribe or colour but apparently more to do with general misanthropy if it suits you to think so.

    Take an example closer to home: the House of Commons is full of people of different social classes, colours, religions, sexes, political tribes and ethnicities. They are all just people and who among us finds it hard to treat the lot of them collectively with blanket and visceral contempt?

    And when Newmania scorns incontinent retired Englishmen which of us would not wish him to be left to macerate in a vat of his own pipi when uncontrollable micturition afflicts him? He is just people, too, but a strikingly unpleasant example and malodorous too – if not yet, then soon.

  30. BBC reports hundreds of thousands join Canada climate strike.
    According to my daughter a lot of the schools treated it as a field trip for social studies with teachers present and school transport so not exactly spontaneous protest movement

  31. Apparently it’s fine for my wife to say English people look “retarded” but when I say Filipinos look like pirates I’m being racist.

    ho hum.

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