There’s an answer here

Why won’t UCL treat us cleaners like its other staff?
Leia Maia Donda
We are on strike today because the university refuses to give outsourced workers the same rights as direct employees

The reason for having outsourced workers is so that the university doesn’t have to pay for the same rights it offers its direct employees.

This is the entire point.

And, you know, think about it. Why would we expect cleaners to gain the same pension rights as professors?

18 thoughts on “There’s an answer here”

  1. And, you know, think about it. Why would we expect cleaners to gain the same pension rights as professors?

    Well cleaners add some clear value to society, professors on the other hand…

  2. They won’t get the same pension, because in any case it’s final salary based, and depends on the number of years in the job.

    And for all its faults, London is safer than Brazil, and jobs are easier to find. Betcha she got her operations cheaper and better here than in her native country, no matter how shite we think the NHS is.

  3. They aren’t striking against UCL.

    ‘Why won’t UCL treat us cleaners like its other staff?’

    Because you don’t work for them. You work for the contractor UCL hired to do the cleaning.

    Guardian subs didn’t pick up on this not so subtle distinction.

  4. Leia Maia Donda is a 42-year-old mother of three, janitor and janitorial supervisor from Brazil

    I’ve got an idea…

  5. So you know how we always hear about how difficult it is for non-EU nationals to move here, how frightfully unfair that is, and that’s why we need a points system and yadda yadda yadda…

    How come we have imported cleaners from Brazil, and how come petrol stations are staffed by thickly accented chappies from the Subcontinent then? I assume they’re not all bored surgeons and rocket scientists moonlighting in menial second jobs.

    A mother of three who scrapes out a living cleaning toilets in London is never gonna earn enough to pay back the schools n hospitals and state pension and tax credits and whatnot she, and her family, will consume. That’s arguably the price we pay for living in a functional society – but only if we limit who gets access to the welfare state. It’s more like a Ponzi scheme if we keep importing inequality.

    The solution is a Pigou tax on migrant labour. Make employers pay the full cost of their immigrant workforce, no hidden taxpayer subsidies. Let’s see if it makes sense to hire South Americans – instead of Doris down the road – then.

  6. Hallowed Be,
    Students working on campus is a thing in the U.S.: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Work_college

    All the “work colleges” were started by Presbyterians, unsurprisingly. The two largest are Berea College and College of the Ozarks, with some 1,600 students each. They demand 10-15 hours a week of student labour; but in exchange they don’t charge tuition fees. Being located in unglamorous parts of the country, accommodation is cheap too.

  7. If we get our benefits vs incentives right, we don’t need to import cleaners from Brazil or elsewhere.

    See: https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/work-pay-and-benefits/unemployment-and-economic-inactivity/economic-inactivity/latest

    22% of working age people (people aged 16 to 64) in England, Wales and Scotland were economically inactive in 2018, which means they were out of work and not looking for a job

    20% of White people were economically inactive in 2018, compared with 30% of people from all other ethnic groups combined

    the highest economic inactivity rate was in the combined Pakistani and Bangladeshi ethnic group, at 38%

    the lowest economic inactivity rate was in the Other White ethnic group, at 15%
    in every region, White people had a lower economic inactivity rate than the combined rate for all other ethnic groups

    in every ethnic group, women were more likely than men to be economically inactive
    the biggest gap between men and women was in the combined Pakistani and Bangladeshi ethnic group, where 56% of women and 21% of men were economically inactive (a gap of 35 percentage points)

  8. “How come we have imported cleaners from Brazil, and how come petrol stations are staffed by thickly accented chappies from the Subcontinent then? I assume they’re not all bored surgeons and rocket scientists moonlighting in menial second job”

    One assumes its down to a combination of a) historic European colonialism, b) the rules on what ancestors you need to get a European passport and c) freedom of movement within the EU. If you come from a part of the world that was once a European colony/had significant links with a European nation, then chances are lots of people can find a European grandparent or two and qualify for a European passport. This of course then means they can go anywhere within the EU. Hence why there are lots of Goans in my home town – Goa was a Portuguese colony, and anyone who can find (or invent) a Portuguese ancestor can get a Portuguese passport and head straight for the UK. Ditto Brazil, as it also was a Portuguese colony. This of course would all stop once we leave the EU, because just having a Spanish or Belgian passport would not be an open ticket to the UK, just the rest of the EU.

  9. I have never known a woman to be economically inactive. If they mean not employed in a salaried job, then say it. You can’t stop them spending, and that is a more important economic activity them working for someone.

  10. It is not fair that the brain surgeons are being paid more than the staff that cleans the operating theatres. All staff contribute to the positive outcomes of medical procedures!

  11. Andrew M, I know a thing or twelve about Berea College. Both my parents were students. I have furniture my father made in the carpentry shop, circa 1943.

    I was born in Berea.

  12. @Steve December 5, 2019 at 12:53 pm

    +10 Agree

    @Theo

    Good info, thx

    @Jim December 5, 2019 at 2:34 pm

    +1 Portugal [allegedly] being swamped by Venezuelans applying for citizenship/passport/ID-Card

  13. «Why would we expect cleaners to gain the same pension rights as professors? »

    There is a big difference between “same pension money” and “same pension rights”, and why shouldn’t professors have the same pension rights as cleaners, even if their pensions were otherwise proportional to their incomes?
    In any case many universities have already outsourced a large chunk of academics too, who get the same pensions rights, and salaries not enormously better than, cleaners. In practice only “insiders” like directors and top professors get good pension level and good pension rights too, because they are “trusties” who keep the others down.

    The real answer here is actually “because there is a buyer’s market for labour in the UK” (including much academic labour) thanks to globalist thatcherism.

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