El-Twatto on the weekend

There is, then, to be a hard Brexit. Any pretence to the contrary has gone.

It is exceptionally difficult to understand Javid. What he is saying is that although the world is now very obviously dominated by just three markets, with the standards of at least one of which business has no choice but comply if it is to compete on an international stage, the UK is to go it alone with its own standards which will not comply with those of any of these markets.

Lessee now.

So, British standards will be different. That means that any foreigner wanting to sell here must abide by British standards. Which most won’t bother with because a tiny market. Which means that most foreign competition will now be removed from the British market as it doesn’t meet our standards.

Snippa complains about this presumably?

61 comments on “El-Twatto on the weekend

  1. I just posted “too quickly”. My typing speed usually gives rise to mirth so I must be improving.

  2. I am sure the BSI will be able to bugger this up, probably by some absurd mishmash of all available standards

  3. If the UK is such an insignificant market, how do we explain the ready availability of right-hand-drive Beemers?

  4. You need to do something about the spam caper Tim. I can’t even see this lock icon to clear the site cache. I cleared cookies on my comp but zero effect.

    Murph is fulla shite. 4th or 5th largest economy is not too small to bother with. Time the Project Fear crowd were punished. A kicking would be a good start.

  5. Removing “foreign competition”,from the UK market , means erecting Non Tariff barriers against food clothes components and the rest of the fabric of our lives. This is not an option, its a disaster.
    The people who decided this was a good idea don`t do anything. As they don`t do anything they don`t know anything. As a consequence of this,their version of the country is one you might encounter in a Topsy and Tim Book. ” Mr Smith is Fisherman .. look he is going to get his boat …”
    Outside a few whining pikey parasites this is not what people do for a living. We live in a complex service providing country and, for example, money held in the UK will no longer insurance security in the EEA. The same is true visa versa pushing up costs diminishing profits and making London the worst place in Europe to trade within our biggest market in Insurance.
    I have looked this week at various models of the loss of GDP thus far and whilst each will be called a remain counter revolutionary heresy, there is remarkable consistency in the estimations the scale of damage inflicted on country .It is grim, and thats before we get on the black run on a teas tray next month

    PS Interesting article by David Gauke today on Con Home ( Now Brexit home )- I agree with him

  6. @Remania – It would be much easier to engage constructively with you if you were even slightly capable of expressing yourself coherently.

    So either make an effort or go back to frothing about elderly Nazis or whatever.

  7. Hard Brexit? Nah, Javid is just posturing. Possibly adopting a negotiating position, if he’s clever. But they’re still aiming for as-close-as-possible alignment with the EU. If nothing else, negotiating external trade deals is hard work with no political rewards. Public choice theory applies.

  8. I surmise he is frotting his mangled manparts to death about a calculated 3% decline over 20 years in a number that is estimated to the nearest 10 % and normally falls outside that range. In other words, we are not dealing with imprecision, nor inaccuracy, nor uncertainty…. We are talking pinning tails on donkeys

  9. Decnine,

    About 1/3 of the world drives on the left:

    Anguilla
    Antigua
    Australia
    The Bahamas
    Bangladesh
    Barbados
    Bermuda
    Bhutan
    Botswana
    British Virgin Islands
    Brunei
    Cayman Islands
    Channel Islands
    Christmas Island
    Cocos Islands
    Cook Islands
    Cyprus
    Dominica
    Falkland Islands
    Fiji
    Grenada
    Guyana
    Hong Kong
    India
    Indonesia
    Ireland
    Isle of Man
    Jamaica
    Japan
    Kenya
    Kiribati
    Lesotho
    Macao
    Malawi
    Malaysia
    Maldives
    Malta
    Mauritius
    Montserrat
    Mozambique
    Namibia
    Nauru
    Nepal
    New Zealand
    Nieu Island
    Norfolk Island
    Pakistan
    Papua New Guinea
    Pitcairn Island
    St Helena
    St Kitts-Nevits (-Anguilla)
    St Lucia
    St Vincent
    Seychelles
    Singapore
    Solomon Islands
    Somalia
    South Africa
    Sri Lanka
    Surinam
    Swaziland
    Tanzania
    Thailand
    Tokelau Islands
    Tonga
    Trinidad and Tobago
    Turks and Caicos Islands
    Tuvalu
    Uganda
    United Kingdom
    Virgin Islands (U.S.)
    Zambia
    Zimbabwe

    … so there is a market for cars without indicators elsewhere than in the UK!

  10. We are getting a hard Brexit because the referendum focused on demonising immigrants. All sorts of now forgotten nonsense was invented, about how we could negotiate an end to FOM and access to the EEA / EU. They now form the worlds largest intellectual landfill. Brexit lies.
    In fact there was a choice, ethnic cleansing or prosperity services and security. It is also forgotten, that prior to Ms May`s first speech to the Conservative conference, preliminary negotiations with the EU were held. The UK was told that whilst they may well be able to sell crap to the cretins, such products were unwelcome in serious company.
    The hard Brexit which the referendum had denied was henceforth presented as a choice.

    This is built on a foundation of lies racism and political self interest. Rose West`s Patio had a nastier underpinning but other than that its the shittiest yet

  11. One part of me thinks that if Newmania hates it this much, we must be going in the right direction.

    The more serious part of me thinks he’s posturing to cover for a weak Brexit.

  12. Imagine if you were being defended by Newmania… I guess you would try to eat the glass in the witness box.

    If he were the prosecution, you would be booking a trip to Barbados

  13. Macao (ex Portugal) and Surinam (ex Dutch) drive on the left? Colour me surprised. Mind you, the last time I was in Macao, 1990, the only true roads went from the ferry terminal to the edge of the city

  14. Let’s be realistic — there is no “Free Trade” in this world, only Managed Trade. And non-tariff barriers (such as regulatory standards) are probably even more significant than tariffs.

    Negotiating Managed Trade deals is a long slow process — President Trump’s re-negotiation of NAFTA has taken 3 years. The EU-Canada deal took close to a decade. Post-Brexit UK will be faced with adjusting to that reality one way or another. Perhaps Boris will fail to die in a ditch once more, and extend the interim period with the EU? Or perhaps the UK will find itself cutting some fairly unfavorable deals? Or perhaps the UK will be stuck on the outside with WTO terms? Whatever the result, it is not going to be “Free Trade”.

  15. @Newmania, speaking of lies as you were:
    “…because the referendum focused on demonising immigrants”

    You made that up.

    Surely you remember that we ALL lived through it too and so we all saw what actually happened?

  16. the UK is to go it alone with its own standards which will not comply with those of any of these markets.

    UK standards would not comply only if the UK chose to not comply. So I’m not seeing the problem here. If the UK wants greater integration into someone else’s market, they could always adopt those standards. If they don’t, then they don’t.

    And really, potential UK exporters will, if there’s money to be made, create product variants that will comply with those market standards. So, really, the only complaint here is that if the majority of the UK doesn’t want to comply with, say, American standards then the supply of American imports will be constrained by the same thinking about exports.

  17. “Newmania
    January 18, 2020 at 2:28 pm

    Removing “foreign competition”,from the UK market , means erecting Non Tariff barriers against food clothes components and the rest of the fabric of our lives. This is not an option, its a disaster.”

    Which the EU is already doing by insisting on their own cloistered set of standards for the EU – which erects non-tariff barriers for non-EU importers.

    So, please explain, if you would, how its good for the UK to trade inside the Single Market but ok to set up barriers to trade outside of it? Why its good to trade with France but not Mexico?

  18. “The people who decided this was a good idea don`t do anything. As they don`t do anything they don`t know anything. ”

    But the ones in Brussels – a thousand miles away – have better knowledge of what the UK does and does not need?

  19. By being outside any major trading blocks, Australia and New Zealand have been turned into wastelands. Or not.

    I believe Switzerland is a hell-hole too.

    (And it’s too funny that a list containing the UK, Ireland, Australia and India is weak!)

  20. It may be a problem. But it is a problem needs putting into proportion. The majority of UK workers do not work for companies engaged in exports. Of those that are, a small proportion work for companies export to the EU. Exports to the EU are trivial relative to the overall size of the UK economy. For which purpose the UK has to be tied to EU standards for all the goods & services it produces & suffer the costs thereof.
    Or to put another way. The purpose of the UK economy is not to protect Newmonia’s job.

  21. Regarding Left-hand to Right-hand driving, I saw some figures a while back which made them roughly equal markets, across the world, excluding the USA.
    The USA, having to pick just one side, and with rather a lot of cars, inevitably unbalances the result.

  22. “India and Pakistan are large & growing markets”

    “Oh, and Japan! A notoriously small market for cars.”

    [A small market for imports.]

    “(And it’s too funny that a list containing the UK, Ireland, Australia and India is weak!)”

    There is your third. No need for listing little islands.

  23. It appears Murphy has been given a peerage. Karie Murphy that is (what a fucking disgrace).
    And Prem Sikka – complete moron, but the upside is that spudda will be absolutely livid.

  24. The ironicalness when you realise that right-on Racistfinder General Newmania wants to keep African farmers poor and excluded from our supermarkets, while the thick.racist.pricks want to help the coloured chappies get rich selling us their produce.

    It’s like ra-ai-aiiiiinnnn….

  25. “The ironicalness when you realise that right-on Racistfinder General Newmania wants to keep African farmers poor and excluded from our supermarkets, while the thick.racist.pricks want to help the coloured chappies get rich selling us their produce.”

    To be fair its not so much the African farmers who are excluded from the EU markets, as raw materials tend to have low tariffs and special exemptions. Its the African entrepreneurs who might like to process the raw material in their own country, and then export to the EU who are cut off at the knees by high tariffs. A system designed to feather the nests of the EU food processors of course, so they can get access to cheap raw materials, but not have to face any cheap competition for the finished goods.

  26. As Aggy says, there’s nothing to stop UK manufacturers choosing to follow EU regulations if they so choose. So many people seem to have this hole in the head where they believe “we will not be forced to do X” means “we will be forced to do not-X”.

  27. Jim – IIUIC their tariffs on commodity ag products are pretty high too:

    * Over 10% for fruit and fish
    * Over 15% for cereals
    * Nearly 40% for dairy

    These are average tariffs according to the WTO, so taking into account the EU’s complicated fuckery over limited exemption schemes and whatnot.

    I dunno much about farming, but I do know that even a couple of percentage points can screw you out of a commodity sale, cos it’s a commodity.

    But you’re probably right, we’d like to see African farmers move up the value chain. Tariffs and the CAP give them no chance.

  28. Hmmm. Maybe Harry and Meghan are on a special under cover mission to Canada to arrange post Brexit trade deal.

    Special deals for high tea at the Empress Hotel.

  29. Chester — an interesting feature of Japanese auto imports is that most of them are Japanese-brand cars manufactured in Japanese-owned factories in lower-cost jurisdictions like Malaysia. It seems that, apart from Yakusa, most Japanese do not want to drive a foreign car.

    Since much of what is left of the English auto industry is Japanese-owned, presumably post-Brexit UK could compete with Malaysia for the privilege of exporting Japanese-brand automobiles back to Mother Japan. The world certainly has changed!

  30. What the fuck is up with the fucking comments? They keep getting eaten or I’m posting too quickly or some such silly shit. The web monkey needs a smack.

  31. The people who decided this was a good idea don`t do anything.

    So everyone who voted Brexit is unemployed? I’m sure we’d have noticed if 17odd million people were out of work…

    As they don`t do anything they don`t know anything.

    Because Stephen Hawking was such an idiot…

    In fact there was a choice, ethnic cleansing or prosperity services and security.

    Point to one bit of published promotional material from the leave side that calls for ethnic cleansing.
    I’ll wait…

  32. Mercedes Benz sell 70,000 cars a year in Japan. That’s a lot of Yakuza.

    BMW 50,000 a year. More Yakuza?

    Proportionally not a lot. Still not nothing.

  33. Does living and working in Australia count as doing nothing as I don’t do anything in the UK other than eat, drink and sleep once per year when we visit on our holidays?

  34. Jim/Steve:

    The issue here as I understand it is that the EU favours EU-based value-added so that, for example, it’s relatively free of tarrif to import cocoa beans into the EU but relatively expensive to import chocolate bars.

    On the other hand it’s relatively uneconomic to import citrus fruits into the EU because of the tarriffs. EU citrus growers are protected but cocoa growers in the EU need no protection because there aren’t any.

    Occasionally the question can become contentious as in the case of rice a few years ago when the Commission faced the thorny question of whether EU consumers should pay an inflated price for rice in order to support a handful of rice growers in the paddy fields of southern France (and Italy?)

    I never finished studying the vexed rice question as I ought to have because someone said that Newmie had a fresh post so I dropped everything to read that instead².
    _____
    1) Wretched site eats the post and calls 2nd attempt a duplicate.
    2) Fib

  35. I’m still trying to work out what happened to the post appeared & subsequently disappeared. Or maybe being critical of the sainted Madsen Pirie was too much for TimW

  36. Should British standards be more onerous on producers than those presently in place they will indeed deter imports, as well as deterring British production.
    As far as I know the proposal is to make British standards less onerous, having the opposite effect.

  37. Pat, surely we know what the civil service is capable of doing, especially since it’s stuffed full of Labour-voting Remainers

  38. I’m pretty certain I’v not written about Madsen recently. And I’ve not wiped any posts either…..

  39. Occasionally the question can become contentious as in the case of rice a few years ago when the Commission faced the thorny question of whether EU consumers should pay an inflated price for rice in order to support a handful of rice growers in the paddy fields of southern France (and Italy?)

    Italy grows a lot of rice (around Milan and elsewhere), but it’s short-grain rice (Arborio) for risotto, not the long-grain (Basmati) for your curry. Similarly Spain for paella (Bomba), etc.

  40. Made you look!

    Note that Hino (?) sells more than BMW in Japan.

    “It seems that, apart from Yakusa, most Japanese do not want to drive a foreign car.”

    Even in US. It is extremely rare to see an Asian in America driving an American car.

  41. It was a rather long O/T about 2 or 3 days ago. Inspired by a link one of the other commenters posted. Apparently Pirie has swallowed the food out of sunlight bollocks Moonbat was raving about. I would have expected better of an economist.

    It definitely posted OK. But damned if I can find it now. But a lot of strange things seemed to be happening on your site at the time. Roughly concurrent with the onset of the “you’re posting too quickly” nonsense..

  42. “About 1/3 of the world drives on the left”

    A third. By land mass? By population?

    The list provided is a list of countries. So of the 200 or so countries in the world, a third drive on the left.

    The list includes tiny places I never heard of. So Witchie’s claim is based on the irrelevant.

    Along comes other commenters who switch the criteria to population. And, indeed, by population, a third do drive on the left.

    Therefore, “(And it’s too funny that a list containing the UK, Ireland, Australia and India is weak!)” is weak.

    “You need to stop writing now. You are embarrassing yourself.”

    Back atcha.

  43. To be honest, gamecock, a lot of the countries drive on the right we’ve never heard of either. And of the ones we have, which side they drive on is more a technical description. If you’re unfortunate enough to go there, you find they drive on whichever side suits them. Or straight down the middle. Or few of the roads are wide enough to have a left or right. Or is decided by the goats.

  44. @Gamecock What do you mean, Swaziland isn’t a market? The King bought 63 luxury German vehicles recently. One for each of his wives. We Africans don’t fuck around.

  45. @Gamecock You could have googled Hino and you would have known that it makes trucks and buses, not luxury or even ordinary cars.

  46. It’s not just a case of which side of the car you put the driving wheel and other controls.

    The USA and EU and probably Japan have completely different crash test specifications. Off the top of my head I can’t remember which way round it is but in one they get tested against a crash at an angle of 30deg but in the other its head on. So even if you produce the correct steering wheel variant it still costs a fortune to change the design and get it tested to the relevant safety regs.

  47. TMB: that was about the substance of my point – the EU protects EU producers (where it has them), and specifically targets higher value processed goods over raw materials where it has no producers, to protect EU processors.

  48. Thanks Jim,

    Perhaps the UK aid budget should now compensate for decades of UK membership of the EU and its precursors and concentrate on promoting private sector initiatives in Africa designed to increase the local value-added on domestic production.

    It’s always baffling that administrations in the West spend aid £££ on public projects overseas when our own government projects devour £££ to no discernible positive effect beyond public sector employment.

  49. @Jim January 18, 2020 at 10:42 pm
    @jgh January 18, 2020 at 11:01 pm
    @Chester Draws January 19, 2020 at 1:01 am

    +1

    @Gavin

    By volume UK exports may be dominated by Nissan etc (although iirc only 10% of Hondas go to EU)

    By value was premium & niche (eg ~£80k track-day) brands last time I checked

    @TMB¹

    Cough, Cane Sugar, Bananas… cough

    @The Meissen Bison January 19, 2020 at 11:01 pm

    +1

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