We used to have just such a system

After the horrific murder of Grace Millane, it’s worth reflecting on safety measures for dating

Seems fair enough, there ought to be such rules.

Which we used to have of course. Don’t bed anyone you’ve not got to know for example. Dropping knickers making on vulnerable and thus something to be done either sparingly or after due consideration.

Sure, that then reduces the amount of fun the blokes are having too but it was a set of rules that did largely work to address the problem.

Possibly a pity that the set of rules was abandoned as being unfashionable, eh?

25 thoughts on “We used to have just such a system”

  1. I suspect if the bloke had called the police right away and said it was a sex game wrong, he’d have been found not guilty.

    She was actively seeking pervy choke sex with strangers and not even applying a teeny bit of common sense. That behaviour runs a massive risk of either an accident or hooking up with some sicko.

    The Mail story above is now trying to whitewash her inclinations, despite the court hearing that she was part of an online BDSM community and the testimony of a former boyfriend who said they had ‘experimented’ with him choking her.

  2. JuliaM – it’s weird. Seen people on the internet claim it’s because he’s Maori but he looks like a white guy to me. The MSM and governments’ habit of politically correct censorship seems to be increasing racial paranoia, not reducing it.

    Don’t bed anyone you’ve not got to know for example.

    Maybe also don’t let your little girl travel around the world alone? The world is full of evil men and young Western girls have the survival instincts of a mentally challenged dodo and, sadly, Wonder Woman doesn’t real.

    Allowing your 22 year old daughter to go backpacking in strange foreign countries is like allowing Arthur C Clarke to babysit your 12 year old boy.

  3. but also by listing their locations all the way through and perhaps taking a photo of themselves with their date and storing it online. Don’t apologise, just do it, be upfront and “uncool” about it. If someone doesn’t like it, or calls you paranoid or weird, get out of there

    Telling people where you’re going? – Ok basic safety precautions if you’re unsure about who you’re meeting. I might also add not being a trollop and jumping into bed on the first date also helps.

    Taking a photo with them and putting it online? Wtf? How is that conversation going to go?
    “can we just take a pic together so i can put it online in case you murder me?”
    A question like that raises massive red flags. Wanting a picture with someone you just met is bad enough.
    Or maybe I’m just out of touch wiv da yoof…

  4. I like this one:
    “It could be said that much of the no-strings, arguably male-centric online hooking-up model fails anyone who’s looking for a relationship.”

    Tinder was never set up for finding “relationships”, dearie. It’s set up to find someone quick when you’re Hot and Bothered. “Relationships” appear as a tertiary bonus, if and when, on this platform.

    As for “male-centric”… There’s a host of women that use Tinder to “hunt themselves a hunk of man-flesh” when they feel like it.
    These women don’t follow the Puritan and Feminist narrative so are, in this case, simply ignored. With the option of Slut-Shaming held in reserve, as usual.
    Then again, those ladies tend to have a definite opinion about Puritans and Feminists as well, so it evens out, I guess..

    And I doubt whether any set of Rules or Chaperonage can prevent stuff like this. After all, the real assholes wear a mask in public to hide the predator. Because there’s still “rules of engagement”, and there’s still plenty of people that can tag a predator when they spot one.

  5. The Guardo manages to be not even wrong:

    It could be said that much of the no-strings, arguably male-centric online hooking-up model fails anyone who’s looking for a relationship.

    Why would you assume people who use the real-life equivalent of Michael Yorke’s Shag-O-Matic from LOGAN’S RUN are “looking for a relationship”?

    And how is a sexual marketplace where any girl who doesn’t have three eyes or something can get a shag, while the majority of male participants are doomed to wanking alone, forever, “arguably male-centric”?

    Under the evil Patriarchy, we had a sort of Chestertonian sexual distributivism where nearly everybody could expect to find a mate for life. Looks like young people now exist in a sort of Mad Max style coital anarchy, and whose fault is that?

    While there’s nothing wrong with casual sex,

    Maybe this is the fucking problem: there’s nothing casual about sex. Maybe our ancestors treated it seriously because it’s actually important and humping with the gay abandon of dogs at the park has serious negative consequences.

  6. Actually, the shocker is that this sort of thing is so rare. Despite all the drunk young women hooking up with bad men in every Western country every weekend, hardly any of them end up dead.

    The corollary is that it’s not worth changing the rules of dating just to avoid incredibly rare events like these.

  7. All casual capers are a danger now.

    The man may not be in as much danger of murder but some lying bitch/mental case only has to pick up the phone and say you raped her and your seed is all over the place–as it might be–and that is the end of you.

    The other side is dim females sans the sense God gave a gnat wandering around the world as if it was their living room.

    And how much worse one night stands where someone only met hours before will be choking her unconscious before the end of the evening?

    Mad enough by reason of accidental death. But it is a scene that will have a few males whose real desire is to strangle a young woman to death. Perhaps they haven’t because their local “scene” only has aged re-tread female perverts whose leathery necks are not attractive enough to risk jail etc for. But when an attractive young woman hoves into view who wants to be choked perhaps the fantasy takes over and the malefactor calculates it is worth the risk to live out his evil dream. Esp if he can claim it was accidental. Hell it could be accidental.

    The cheeky cow in the Gladrag saying violent men are responsible is esp evil given the circs. Time that trash rag was gone. Do they still get the govt job adverts?

  8. PJF – I dunno about that, who paid for her flights and whatnot?

    Call me old fashioned, but I’m the goddamn paterfamilias and the Romans* basically did nothing wrong.

    *Apart from Saturn as depicted by Goya, obvs, that was mental.

  9. There is no shortage of reasonably sensible women employing safety measures. I met my now wife via one of the more relationship orientated websites.

    Internet dating has increased the number of higher risk meetings. Was the random stranger in the pub anymore likely to be a wrongun than random internet man met in the public place by arrangement? Probably similar, but wronguns are massively enabled by the internet so more meetings and more opportunities for bad outcomes occur.

    Men are also dim about the risk of a female psycho being encountered. The outcome is less news worthy and still lasts a life time.

    It appears casual sex has a price regardless of who engages because men and women with other men or women make themselves so damn vulnerable to the few really evil people out there.

    If you enjoy being kinky choke sexed, you are “Fucking” stupid not to really really have a sound basis to trust the person socially….. To engage in this casually must give you a life expectancy of the cheapest dockyard whore……

  10. Perhaps I’ve led a sheltered life, but I didn’t know there was such a thing as choking sex until I was in my early 40s. I mean, I knew about Milligan and Hutchence, but that people did it to each other? Nah. I don’t think I was even very saintly when I was this girl’s age. It just seems this stuff is mainstream now.

  11. I’m not a girl.

    Reading Ellen’s article (okay, I couldn’t go more than a couple of paragraphs), I got the idea she was saying what every mother has taught their daughters since time immemorial.

    “Watch out for creeps.”

    So what is the point of the article? None, that I can see. Titillation over a murder in NZ? Her audience appears to be women. But every woman on the planet already knows what she is saying.

  12. …who paid for her flights and whatnot?

    If your little princess wants to be tied up by a stranger and fucked whilst being choked, she can manage that just as well in Croydon.

    Loads of youngsters travel the world (even the Amish). Loads of those enjoy casual sexual relationships as they go (even the Amish). Some of those like it rough (Amish?). Thankfully, hardly anyone gets killed.

    As Andrew M says, no need to change things over exceptions like this.

  13. “If your little princess wants to be tied up by a stranger and fucked whilst being choked, she can manage that just as well in Croydon.”

    Quite. When it comes to the “dangerous hellholes list” I suspect that there are several places in the UK which come higher than anywhere in New Zealand.

  14. PJF – Dunno. I’m pretty sure the Amish have fewer of their daughters becoming camwhores or doing a Masters degree in dildos, for example. Travelling around the world is probably a lot more dangerous than a night out in Croydon, if only because people let their guard down on holiday.

    no need to change things over exceptions like this

    Except we kinda do if we want grandchildren, no?

  15. Except we kinda do if we want grandchildren, no?

    What have exceptional incidents got to do with the likelihood of grandchildren?

  16. PJF – the murder is the exceptional bit. The “getting pumped by enough strangers to embarrass an Edwardian East End whore” part is depressingly common. Never in the field of human sexytimes have so many fucked so much to create so few babbies.

  17. @Andrew M February 23, 2020 at 9:46 am

    Spot on. Yet Left will be howling for a ‘Grace’s Law’ on the specious argument of “if it saves one life – consequences? Don’t care, virtue signalling trumps sensible”

    Does naming one’s daughter Grace predispose her to rebel against her name?

    @Steve February 23, 2020 at 11:07 am

    +1 on “who paid?” Anything I did that my parents didn’t like or said I didn’t need had to be paid for by me, eg bikes (inc helmet etc) & cars

    @Itellyounothing

    Men are also dim about the risk of a female psycho being encountered

    +1 eg Harry

    @Lud

    “sheltered life” – me too, I didn’t encounter “everyone smokes pot at Uni”. Saw the BDSM scene in mid 30s at Torture Garden – wow, we’d thought it was Hollywood fiction

    @JS February 23, 2020 at 12:54 pm

    “dangerous hellholes list”

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muhnjdklQ4Q
    I wonder who the PONA was?

  18. Dirty slut into kink dies.

    Won’t somebody do something!

    On a more serious note, this is a woman actively seeking out a bad man to [email protected] her roughly whilst she was away from home and being Daddy’s little princess. She had done it before, I suspect she has done it many more times than we know about. It went wrong. Although there is a man out there who would, in a different universe, be married to this skank thinking she was the answer to his dreams. He dodged a bullet.

  19. Re: Why is the ‘Guardian’ so reticent?

    They may have a reporter on the ground here that potentially could be arrested; or, alternatively, they are deciding to respect our ridiculous laws on name suppression. The laws were designed back when New Zealand was even smaller than it is now so literally everyone knew everyone; now we have at least 1 step, and sometimes 2, of separation!

    Name suppression normally lapses on, or soon after, conviction – especially when you are an adult and are going to be spending a while at Lizzie’s pleasure. The fact that it hasn’t probably means that we can expect to hear about some other cases involving him in the near future.

  20. Under the evil Patriarchy, we had a sort of Chestertonian sexual distributivism where nearly everybody could expect to find a mate for life. Looks like young people now exist in a sort of Mad Max style coital anarchy, and whose fault is that?

    Bravo, sir.

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