Tells me a lot that you assume a knowledge of Terry Pratchett, goes with being divorced attending enactments of Anglo Saxon life, droning on about real ale, a beard and evil of all kinds.
I thought you were on about Midsummer Night`s Dream , (sweet cheeks )
Dennis, Gender Solid
Cheery Littlebottom is a trans sexual.
Well, that just adds to my lack of interest…
Harry Haddock's Ghost
Still praying for you, Newmania.
When did you first become aware of your repressed bigotry; was it at school, or much later on when the posh kids at Uni laughed behind your back because you went to a minor public school, and thus didn’t invite you on their skiing shenanigans? Did you feel all dirty and nouveau? Had your parents not made sufficient inroads into the social strata that you pined for, and you blame them? Is that who you are really ranting at – are you still angry with Mummy and her petty lower middle class ways? Let it all out, old chap. We’re here to help.
John
Newmania’s quick response indicates that he too is a fan of the great Terry Pratchett. It’s nothing to be ashamed of.
So Much For Subtlety
It is worse than humourless. It misses the point of Littlebottom. She is not trans-sexual. She is escaping trans-sexualism.
She was born into a community that insisted girls dress as men. Her character arc is about her discovering and expressing her feminine nature.
Arthur the Cat
“Cheery Littlebottom is a trans sexual.”
And huge for a dwarf, which rather destroys the joke about Carrot Ironfoundersson.
Surreptitious Evil
Cheery isn’t trans or escaping trans. She’s escaping mandatory cross-dressing. They keep telling us they aren’t the same. Well, except when it matters to them, the most recent Rowling row also an example.
Grikath
Wasn’t it the great sir PTerry himself who ruthlessly spoofed this kind of nonsense with the Campaign for Equal Height? In several books, no less…
Grikath
SMFS: “She was born into a community that insisted girls dress as men.”
Ummm no.. The characterisation of dwarves by Pratchett is extremely clear: Within the dwarf communities there simply was no distinction between male and female, except where the issue of producing new dwarves was concerned.
And that simply required some polite and very circumspect inquiries during the initial contract negotiations between the respective partners and their parents. ( and even then adoption was always on the cards if the prospective couple misjudged… Mines are dangerous places, after all…)
Dwarves are very much aware of the two genders. It simply is not an issue when it comes to being a dwarf.
The shock value of Cheery ( and later characters) is that she is , to dwarves, an utter and complete exhibitionist, showing something to the Outside, that’s supposed to be a private matter.
She’s a social streaker.
Andrew M
It’s generational. PTerry and Douglas Adams are to 60s kids what JKRowling is to Millennials.
Mark in Mayenne
Mr Gender Solid said it for me
jgh
Grikath: No, dwarfs don’t have two genders, it’s pretty explicit that they only have *ONE* gender, hiding two sexes. Which. Is. The. Entire. Point.
jgh
Since afp got flooded by spam I’ve not been keeping up with “the community”, I dread to think what the fanbase thinks. As with the death of soc.history.what-if I don’t know where everybody’s gone to continue.
Grikath
@jgh: as a native speaker of a proper germanic language I tend to use gender. Sex is the actual gymnastic exercise..
Only modern english can make a thorough mess of such a thing.. *shrug*
Bloke in Germany
Words have gender. People have sex.
MC
jgh/ BiG – agreed.
So Much For Subtlety
Grikath October 13, 2020 at 3:24 pm – “Ummm no.. The characterisation of dwarves by Pratchett is extremely clear: Within the dwarf communities there simply was no distinction between male and female, except where the issue of producing new dwarves was concerned.”
So another way of putting that would be …. umm yes. You agree with me. There is not no distinction. Drawves are, so to speak, heavily gendered. Down to the big beards. It is just that the female ones dress as male. They are not like the younger David Bowie on cocaine. They are clearly male. Even the female ones.
“Dwarves are very much aware of the two genders. It simply is not an issue when it comes to being a dwarf.”
Dwarves cannot reliably tell the two sexes apart. Non-dwarves certainly cannot. It does not follow they are all that aware of it but it would not matter anyway. As they are forcing the female ones to pass as male.
“The shock value of Cheery ( and later characters) is that she is , to dwarves, an utter and complete exhibitionist, showing something to the Outside, that’s supposed to be a private matter.”
As I said. Trans-sexualism is something she is escaping. That is the point.
So Much For Subtlety
Bloke in Germany October 13, 2020 at 7:17 pm – “Words have gender. People have sex.”
More to the point, people often say they don’t have enough sex. I definitely have had enough of gender.
Tells me a lot that you assume a knowledge of Terry Pratchett, goes with being divorced attending enactments of Anglo Saxon life, droning on about real ale, a beard and evil of all kinds.
I thought you were on about Midsummer Night`s Dream , (sweet cheeks )
Cheery Littlebottom is a trans sexual.
Well, that just adds to my lack of interest…
Still praying for you, Newmania.
When did you first become aware of your repressed bigotry; was it at school, or much later on when the posh kids at Uni laughed behind your back because you went to a minor public school, and thus didn’t invite you on their skiing shenanigans? Did you feel all dirty and nouveau? Had your parents not made sufficient inroads into the social strata that you pined for, and you blame them? Is that who you are really ranting at – are you still angry with Mummy and her petty lower middle class ways? Let it all out, old chap. We’re here to help.
Newmania’s quick response indicates that he too is a fan of the great Terry Pratchett. It’s nothing to be ashamed of.
It is worse than humourless. It misses the point of Littlebottom. She is not trans-sexual. She is escaping trans-sexualism.
She was born into a community that insisted girls dress as men. Her character arc is about her discovering and expressing her feminine nature.
“Cheery Littlebottom is a trans sexual.”
And huge for a dwarf, which rather destroys the joke about Carrot Ironfoundersson.
Cheery isn’t trans or escaping trans. She’s escaping mandatory cross-dressing. They keep telling us they aren’t the same. Well, except when it matters to them, the most recent Rowling row also an example.
Wasn’t it the great sir PTerry himself who ruthlessly spoofed this kind of nonsense with the Campaign for Equal Height? In several books, no less…
SMFS: “She was born into a community that insisted girls dress as men.”
Ummm no.. The characterisation of dwarves by Pratchett is extremely clear: Within the dwarf communities there simply was no distinction between male and female, except where the issue of producing new dwarves was concerned.
And that simply required some polite and very circumspect inquiries during the initial contract negotiations between the respective partners and their parents. ( and even then adoption was always on the cards if the prospective couple misjudged… Mines are dangerous places, after all…)
Dwarves are very much aware of the two genders. It simply is not an issue when it comes to being a dwarf.
The shock value of Cheery ( and later characters) is that she is , to dwarves, an utter and complete exhibitionist, showing something to the Outside, that’s supposed to be a private matter.
She’s a social streaker.
It’s generational. PTerry and Douglas Adams are to 60s kids what JKRowling is to Millennials.
Mr Gender Solid said it for me
Grikath: No, dwarfs don’t have two genders, it’s pretty explicit that they only have *ONE* gender, hiding two sexes. Which. Is. The. Entire. Point.
Since afp got flooded by spam I’ve not been keeping up with “the community”, I dread to think what the fanbase thinks. As with the death of soc.history.what-if I don’t know where everybody’s gone to continue.
@jgh: as a native speaker of a proper germanic language I tend to use gender. Sex is the actual gymnastic exercise..
Only modern english can make a thorough mess of such a thing.. *shrug*
Words have gender. People have sex.
jgh/ BiG – agreed.
Grikath October 13, 2020 at 3:24 pm – “Ummm no.. The characterisation of dwarves by Pratchett is extremely clear: Within the dwarf communities there simply was no distinction between male and female, except where the issue of producing new dwarves was concerned.”
So another way of putting that would be …. umm yes. You agree with me. There is not no distinction. Drawves are, so to speak, heavily gendered. Down to the big beards. It is just that the female ones dress as male. They are not like the younger David Bowie on cocaine. They are clearly male. Even the female ones.
“Dwarves are very much aware of the two genders. It simply is not an issue when it comes to being a dwarf.”
Dwarves cannot reliably tell the two sexes apart. Non-dwarves certainly cannot. It does not follow they are all that aware of it but it would not matter anyway. As they are forcing the female ones to pass as male.
“The shock value of Cheery ( and later characters) is that she is , to dwarves, an utter and complete exhibitionist, showing something to the Outside, that’s supposed to be a private matter.”
As I said. Trans-sexualism is something she is escaping. That is the point.
Bloke in Germany October 13, 2020 at 7:17 pm – “Words have gender. People have sex.”
More to the point, people often say they don’t have enough sex. I definitely have had enough of gender.
More to the point, people often say they don’t have enough sex. I definitely have had enough of gender.
I think you probably win the Internet for today.