These emissions are what are called Scope 3 emissions from the gas companies. They are responsible for them because they are the foreseeable emissions that result from their sale of gas. That’s what Scope 3 means – they are the emissions caused by what you sell rather than what you do yourself. They should as a result account for them and the cost of their removal within the supply chain they manage under what I call sustainable cost accounting. If they had to do so then they would be starting to sell heat pumps now.
Gas companies should be selling the heat pumps which don’t use gas?
BP should be selling you the shoes you’ll need for Shank’s Pony? The butcher should be selling you the beans for your vegan diet? Ryanair should be selling train tickets?
Whut?
A more logical argument would be that perhaps should start selling carbon capture systems?
Which leads to the interesting problem that the amount of actual emissions isn’t directly linked to the quantity of input gas. The emissions from a 20 year old domestic boiler is likely to be very different to that of a gas turbine with carbon capture attached.
I guess each company will need a team of inspectors to work out the emissions user by user to calculate the Scope 3 emissions. Or of course we could acknowledge that emissions should only be paid for once, and that it makes most sense for that to be the end user if we are actually trying to reduce emissions (rather than just raw consumption).
Carbon Capture?
Impossible fancy verging on perpetual motion.
If ever attempted, fear. Lookup the Lake Nyos Disaster. Coming to an area near you.
It’s funny how the Greens are hysterical about burying a few tons of toxic nuclear waste, but happy with burying billions of tons of a chemical toxin: although it’s only a toxin if you concentrate it in such an energy-wasteful method. If you just dispersed it in the atmosphere, it is safe and beneficial plant-food.
These Tier 3 emissions? Do they apply if I sell a gas turbine?
Because the only purpose of a gas turbine is to burn gas.
But how much gas, and hence how much emissions must I pay Tier 3 on?
NIL if the customer never opens the box.
Very high, if operated at 100% throttle 24×7.
Do I have to guess something about my customer’s usage for the next N years?
If I guess NIL, so what?
Do I detect a make-work scheme for failed bureaucrats & accountants?
Looks like “sustainable cost accounting” creates stupider carbon offsets to go with its stupider carbon tax.
“A more logical argument would be that perhaps should start selling carbon capture systems?”
Got that covered Mole. Some seeds in a packet. Described as “home carbon capture system, make your house carbon neutral”. Instructions say “Just add water”. Now where do I apply for that grant money?
Worcester/Bosch sell boilers and heat pumps, I suppose BP could buy them from Worcester and resell, but really? For what purpose? I’m sure Worcester and other manufacturers can do a good job of selling their own stuff. Should they also be selling electric stoves, electric heaters to replace other gas appliances?
Even if they did, it’s not like an ASP is an appropriate substitute for the combi boiler that’s in most houses built from the late 80s onward.
I wondered what “partial baths” were. Bogs, i suppose.
Get fucked with a wire brush Mole. We aren’t paying jack shit for your carbon bullshit fantasy.
Is he really complaining that he can’t afford a heat pump?
I have actually just seen an advert from British Gas selling heat pumps.
https://www.directheatingsupplies.co.uk/vaillant-arotherm-plus-air-source-heat-pump-7kw-10037213
Looks like it might (ish) be the same bit of kit.
Over three and a half large.
Uses the natural refrigerant R290….. as if that’s a good thing. It’s PROPANE. Ie a perfectly good fossil fuel we could burn for warmth.
Propane refrigerant? I am currently using it to reduce chicken legs to a perfectly edible state.
Propane refrigerant. What a planet saving idea, what could go wrong?
See Grenfell Tower.
Following on from Tim the Coder, did anyone ever get to the bottom of the initiating event of the Grenfell Tower fire? It was initially reported to have been a refrigerator (propane leak?) but I haven’t seen any confirmation.
According to the spec on that heat pump, it comes without a warranty. Mmmm…
“Gas companies should be selling the heat pumps which don’t use gas?”
Ermm… there’s a current British Gas Utube advert that samples “turn down for What?”- (v annoying shouty person but i guess that’s why i remember it) – advertising zero carbon electricity.
This whole Scope 1,2,3 stuff sounds like an inglorious bureaucratic labyrinth designed by a crazed autistic savant. In not clown world this would be dismissed as the ravings of an obsessive. But here we are. ☹️
@bloke in spain – merely planting seeds does not work as a carbon capture system because the resulting plants will die and re-release everything they absorbed. If you use trees, this usually takes long enough that you’re dead before anyone notices what you have got away with, but there have recently been forest fires in areas that are supposed to be capturing carbon – see https://www.planetizen.com/news/2021/08/114465-carbon-offset-forests-are-burning-wildfires for example. True carbon capture is more like disposal of nuclear waste – you need to find somewhere to store it that will be safe for a long time. Except, of course, the quantity is enormously greater.
@Arthur Dent – evidence to the enquiry said that it was an electrical fault which set fire to a fridge-freezer. Although the enquiry has not finished, the first (Phase 1) official report is available at https://www.grenfelltowerinquiry.org.uk/ and contains a lot of detail.
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