Rishi Sunak will warn that Britain must end its “anti-maths mindset” if the economy is to grow.
In a major speech, the Prime Minister will argue that numeracy is “every bit as essential as reading” and say it is wrong that it is considered “socially acceptable” to be bad at maths.
Tsk. General numeracy would entirely destroy The Guardian’s comment pages now, wouldn’t it?
Its already compulsory till 16. Not much more you can do, insisting we all learn calculus and higher trig and number theory? But if that’s what you think, maths grows the economy, I’d suggest not letting the woke brigade any where near it. Their “improved” maths won’t do a thing for the economy. What’s more your speeches will do diddly squat in that regard, you’ll have to do something to kick that stuff out of schools and unis.
Kids don’t like maths because they’re usually taught it by English graduates who grew up hating maths? Fine, let’s fix that by giving them two more years of the same.
“it is wrong that it is considered “socially acceptable” to be bad at maths.”
“No dogs, no Irish, no innumerates.”
There are three types of people who feel strongly about Rishi’s comment. Those who agree with him, and those who don’t.
Rishi Sunak will warn that Britain must end its “anti-maths mindset” if the economy is to grow.
Nothing to do with the Conservatives taxing the fuck out of you, banning the cheap energy on which economic growth depends, and making it as cheap and easy as possible to replace British workers with Indians.
It’s because you plebs can’t count, you see.
I think the kind of maths taught is more important than the amount
As the comedian Tom Allen puts it – ” Pay attention, class…this is a PENSION FUND”
This ‘everyone must do X’ stuff is utter bollocks. Everyone isn’t the same. Some people find maths uttering incomprehensible, in the same way some people find music utterly incomprehensible (I’m the latter). If you had said I had to study music to the age of 18 I’d have been suicidal. Its fine for someone like Rishi Sunak, who is obviously a pointed headed math geek, but how would he have felt being forced to study something that made his entire life a misery?
And anyway, the people of the country are not ‘resources’ to be directed by the likes of RS, they are individuals who if they don’t want to study maths shouldn’t be forced IMO. Personally I’d let kids leave school at 13 or 14. By then they have had the chance to get the basics, if they don’t want any more thats up to them. Forcing them to stay til 18 just makes them get in the way of those who would like to learn.
Far be it for me to defend that cunt Sunak, but I think he’s absolutely correct to want to counter the “it’s cool to be thick, or shit at maths” mindset.
Absolutely agree here, but if we’re going to give kids the opportunity at 14 to go off and train to be a plumber then it’s definitely worthwhile spending the preceding few years drumming into them that a plumber that’s shit at maths is very soon going to become a skint plumber.
Direct experience of Primary school teaching is that the teachers are (almost without exception) nervous of maths, and tell their pupils in the actual maths lessons that they don’t like it and it’s difficult. By the time the kids leave Primary years, their attitude to maths (and learning “hard” stuff) is embedded.
This cannot be raised as an issue as everyone gets very defensive, and it is treated as an attack on hard working teachers. The reality is that maths is not the primary training for most Primary teachers and they often find it difficult. Some lessons leave the pupils confused because the teacher themselves are confused about the methods they are teaching (yes – Primary school maths).
Of course people shouldn’t be forced down routes they don’t suit, but pupils should feel confident to tackle new subjects rather than scared of them.
This is not a question (as Labour have suggested) of sufficient staffing levels – this is first and foremost an issue with the teaching resources currently being deployed.
“a plumber that’s shit at maths is very soon going to become a skint plumber”
When I was doing my electrical installation course back in the Plaistocene, there was one chap who just couldn’t “get” the simple sums used in wiring. Things like: a cable rating buried in plaster is 70% of the label. “Why?” Irrelevant, just do it. “Argh” Just call it two thirds. “Argh fractions!” Just look in a table. “PANIC!!!!”
My brother used to work in a greengrocers’ and there really are people out there who would not bat an eye if they requested a 50p cabbage and a 75p cauliflower and you charged them £3.
I left school at 15 because I detested it and loathed every minute I had to spend there. Cue a succession of dead end jobs in supermarkets, leafleting, telesales etc before accepting that I really needed to get some qualifications to get ahead.
Night school saved me but those colleges either no longer exist or pretty much only offer English as a Foreign Language. Online courses are available but those do not include the personal introductions and personal references that open doors.
Until adult education is fixed in this country leaving school without a few decent grades is like falling thru a trapdoor with no obvious way back.
I can see where he’s coming from. He’s only got to look around him whilst at the despatch box to see all the innumerate knob heads – that willed us into lockdown, continue to pursue Net Zero, etc etc ….
“it’s cool to be thick, or shit at maths”.
Waycist shurely?
Chris Rock: “A nigga’ll say “I don’t know that shit, I keep it real”…..”Yeah, real dumb. Wanna keep your money? Hide it in a book – Shit, books are like Kryptonite to a nigger”.
Andy T, but our teachers all have degrees and are therefore smarter than everyone else………..
One wonders whether our esteemed Prime Minister is confusing “maths” with “arithmetic”? Everybody needs some ability with arithmetic – otherwise they’re wide-open to “jgh”s “greengrocer paradox” – but genuine mathematical knowledge is only of use to someone in a science- or engineering-based career.
I find it amusing that he’s tilting at the windmills of being happily crap-at-maths when the vast majority of those to be found in both Houses are of the mindset that you’re “cultured” if you’re clued-up on literature, art or ancient Greek, but you’re not if you understand quadratic equations or adiabatic lapse-rates – a distinction that much exercised C.P.Snow (and was cheerfully “sent up” by Flanders and Swan) some 50 years ago..!
Which is why, I guess, that the handful of MPs who voted against the Climate Change Bill were the only ones in the Commons who had scientific or engineering backgrounds.
One wonders whether our esteemed Prime Minister is confusing “maths” with “arithmetic”?
It’s displacement activity. See also promises to (pass legislation to) Stop the Boats.
Remember John Major thought it would be a good idea to go “back to basics”? That’s a bit too suspiciously gammony for Rishi, so he’s going for the irrelevant distraction of Numberwang instead.
The social pressure to be bad at maths affects mainly girls. The overwhelming majority of primary school teachers are female. So it is no surprise that maths is badly taught.
Many a pupil has learnt despite their teachers, not thanks to them.
The whole school (a primary in Cheshire, 1956ish) used to chant the times table 2 up to 12 every morning. Those who were able at all got their arithmetic skills before they were, what, eight.s
That is the basis of numeracy. But it doesn’t preclude carelessness with numbers of the kind one expects from a Guardian journo. Maybe number awareness is not numeracy and should be taught outside of maths classes but in a class on critical thinking and logical argument. In an olympic- sized swimming pool the size of Wales.
“The whole school (a primary in Cheshire, 1956ish) used to chant the times table 2 up to 12 every morning.”
We did the 14 and 16 times tables too. (Stray thought: was that treat reserved for the upper stream?)
I’ll never forgive the Scotnatz for buggering up our schools.
It won’t work because in current education there’s one single problem: Kids Cannot Fail.
It “teaches” them that failure has no consequences. As long as that isn’t fixed, any amount of throwing stuff at the kids isn’t going to work. Period.
Anecdata in this is that I’ve done some remedial teaching in math and arthmetic to some young people ( friends and kids of friends) who were horrible at any form of basic numeracy.
All heavily “in the Spectrum”, properly Labelled, and completely convinced they “sucked at Math”.
It’s funny that all of them got a hell of a lot better at it, including actual basic math and trigonometry, when all other Methods had failed.
Might have something to do with me using old-fashioned material from the 1930’s and 40’s used by the Rotterdam Maritime Institute.
Not the modern fancy stuff, but the solid knowledge you need to build real ships and boilers that can go Bang!, and Stuff.
Geared to people who may have talent, but also no more than basic numeracy in primary school, as one regularly had in those days…
It’s funny how quickly people pick things up when you can show them that that numbery stuff has actual uses.
And yes, I had to buff up as well.. Especially the trigonometry. All those tricks to construct exact angles and shapes with just a bit of string and a pencil went Out Of Fashion in the 60’s..
And there’s a reason that I own a couple of slide rules… They don’t need batteries..
@Grikath, I’m not sure that “boilers that go Bang” are really what you want, but hey, you’re the expert!
Ah ha! As I was driving home I remembered a pertinent recent example.
Can’t remember where, but somebody posted about a pizza shop has run out of 10″ pizzas, so offered – as a special deal – two 6″ pizzas. The shop was completely and utterly unable to comprehend that 72sq of pizza is less than 100sq of pizza. “But 12 is bigger than 10!” No, 72 is less than 100. “No….. 6 plus 6 is 12, that’s bigger than 10, I’m doing you a great deal” It’s an area you dickhead! “Twelve…. ten….”
Worryingly, this is not an isolated instance, the sort of, hmmm, “thinking” is assigning too much cognition to the process, this sort of thing permeates our society deeply.
@Peter The Bang! bit being undesireable and the need for accurate calculation therefore being deemed Important tends to be stressed heavily in those books. With examples. And reminders that the students would regularly be working right next to other peoples’ work and quite possibly their own..
Almost as if the teachers were trying to instill a measure of healthy self-interest in their students. Including the then fact of life that cutting corners will come back to haunt you…
Quite refreshing, really…
And hardly an expert in this, really. Just a Nerd with a nice little library and Unorthodox and Outdated Notions on Education and Teaching Methods.
Most people will only really need to use basic arithmetic and a bit of simple geometry (how many square metres is my lawn?) in their day-to-day lives, but a decent introduction to statistics (and economics) before leaving school would be useful. Could we start with the Cabinet and ‘first division’ civil servants, please? It might spare us such monstrosities as HS2 and Nut Zero.
Having left school at 17, I’m not sure how requiring me to study mathematics until I was 18 would have worked …
@ dearieme
Yes, I reckon that must have been restricted to the ‘A’ stream in schools that had them. One of my earlier memories is of teaching myself the 13 times table when I was 6 (and attending a Scottish Primary School).
@Grikath To be honest, it’s not the technique that is the problem with modern education, it’s the delivery.
If you launch into some maths with enthusiasm, interesting stories and proper acknowledgement of progress, then kids will shine whether the material comes from a 100 year old book or an iPad. If you prevaricate, dither, treat the problems as difficult even for you as an adult, then kids will feel lost and confused and ‘hate’ the subject.