Milei won 55.8 per cent of the vote, against 44.2 per cent for economy minister Sergio Massa of the centre-left Peronist government, with over 99 per cent of votes counted.
Gonna get interesting….
Comment from Tim Newman: “@worstall’s comments section has gone and got itself elected.”
It all depends on whether he can fight the entrenched bureaucrats or not. They will do their utmost to keep their fiefdoms and not have 14% of the state cut out
I’m surprised they didn’t kick half the observers out of the room, cover the windows and get down to counting those good old absentee ballots in the wee small hours leading to days and weeks of undignified wrangling.
But no, Argentina somehow managed to count over 20m votes (not bad but Brazil managed to do the same with nearly 120m) and declare a winner within a few hours of the polls closing.
The completely impartial BBC are not happy “Far-right outsider Milei wins Argentina presidential run-off election”.
Is it possible the Argie elections were hacked by Russia or Brexit, somehow?
@SadButMadLad
I have wondered elsewhere if there is some magic economic inflection point where the benefits of having an Establishment are overtaken by the penalties of stagnation and resistance to change. The Laffer Establishment Curve perhaps?
He’s not the poster boy I would have chosen for policies I generally welcome. However, if he makes a mess of things, or his policies fail, it will be interesting to see whether the libertarian right blame the media, civil service et al in a mirror image of frustrated leftists, or whether they behave more maturely.
It’s the adoption of the US dollar which worries me. How does that differ from, say, Greece adopting the euro, with all the problems and constraints which that brought with it?
“@worstall’s comments section has gone and got itself elected.”
Bloke from Buenos Aires.
Theophrastus – I think it depends on what we mean by mature.
Sitting calmly while your country is overrun and looted by the combined armies of Mordor, Isengard and the Southrons could be a mature response, but I’d rather we were as reckless as Eowyn.
Milei already has entire government departments and the judiciary out for his political or actual blood, and we know his root cause analysis of the problems facing Argentina are correct.
If he fails, it’ll most likely be because the Argie deep state is fortified against democracy.
Paul, it’s no different (except some mechanics of having a stake or not in the issuing central bank), which is why the euro-skeptics were doomed to wrongness from the start. Or, rather, doomed to correctness, but for the wrong reasons.
The (on some measures largest ever) 2011 state bankruptcy of Greece, “haircut”, “austerity”, however you dress it up it was actually a hundred billion euro default, showed that a state can go bust (it’s surprisingly common and not the Armageddon we are told) and keep its currency. I’d say the rest of us carried too much of the costs of it, but hey, that’s politics. Especially when your central bankers constantly revolving-door with Goldman, Morgan, and the rest, and making the lenders eat all of their losses when there’s taxpayers you can farm, would be career-limiting.
Hmmm. Giorgia Meloni in Italy was supposed to be a Right-Wing candidate but look at how she’s turned out…
Well, closing more than a dozen ministries might work.
I wish him luck.
The Black Broadcasting Corporation won’t be happy until Joe wins in 2024 then passes an executive order in 2028 (posthumously) to make Michelle Obama “President in Perpetuity”…
Paul – Argentina is already to some extent dollarized:
For years, Argentinians have preferred to pay for many goods and services in greenbacks, rather than with their own collapsing currency, as part of an informal “blue dollar” currency market.
The value of the peso has plummeted 858% against the US dollar over the past five years as the central bank printed more of the currency to help the country’s spendthrift government avoid defaulting on its debts. That, in turn, fueled rampant price rises.
Annual inflation topped 138% in September, its highest level in 32 years, according to data from the National Institute of Statistics and Censuses
He’d be getting rid of the Argentinan central bankers (good) and giving more power to the evil Gringotts gnomes ones running America down (bad), but that may still count as a yuge win for Argies given how poorly the status quo is doing for them.
Lionise the bankers.
Jonathan – Yes.
ZAGREB, Nov 17 (Reuters) – A deal reached this month by Italy with Albania to build centres for migrants coming ashore by sea could serve as a blueprint for other EU countries, Italian Prime Minister Giorgia Meloni said on Friday.
“I think this can be an example that other countries may follow, particularly if it functions well,” Meloni said through interpreter during a visit to Croatia.
Earlier this month, Meloni and Albanian Prime Minister Edi Rama announced a new scheme for Italy to try to bring down migrant numbers by building two centres that would initially host some 3,000 people when they are due to open in spring 2024.
Outsourcing the protection of Rome to the Foederati didn’t work the first time.
Western countries keep coming up with bizarrely expensive and complicated mechanisms whereby we can be overrun by pube-brained retards + all their useless relatives at maximum expense. It’s a bit like if the Hokey Cokey involved seagoing Islamic paedophile gangs and the RNLI.
Normal countries such as Pakistan and Morocco just kick them out and shoot them if they try to come back.
Some prosperous places use other peoples currencies.
Isle of Man, Jersey, Liechtenstein and Andorra are better off than their currency issuing cousins afaik.
The Euro is interesting. Wikipedia says this:
Benin
Burkina Faso
Guinea-Bissau
Ivory Coast
Mali
Niger
Senegal
Togo
all use the Euro as the official currency. Niger is the outlier as there’s been a coup.
But we’d be curious to know if the others have improved their economies and shrunk the state since 1999.
Dollarisation is certainly not a stupid or scary idea.
Meanwhile,
Households living close to new pylons and electricity substations could receive up to £1,000 a year off energy bills for a decade under new plans.
It is hoped the plan would convince people to support upgrades in their area, which are needed in part for new electric vehicle charging points.
Chancellor Jeremy Hunt is expected to announce the policy in the Autumn Statement on Wednesday.
We have to carpet the entire country in electrical pylons, for the environment.
NB – if they’re offering you a £1K discount, guess how expensive the electricity is gonna be?
Why does the BBC support the rape of British women and children by foreign migrants?
A BBC journalist was hired to give evidence used in a tribunal where a Somali rapist was trying to stay in the UK, it has been claimed.
Mary Harper, the BBC’s Africa editor, was hired as an expert witness by lawyers representing Yaqub Ahmed, in an attempt to block his deportation to Somalia, The Mail on Sunday reported.
The journalist has given evidence in at least seven further immigration cases in the past decade, including in support of a Somali who committed sexual assault on a deaf teenage girl, it was claimed.
Ahmed is a gang rapist who was jailed in 2008 for attacking a teenage girl in London after she was lured from Leicester Square to a flat in Crouch End.
His planned deportation in 2018 was stopped after holidaymakers on his flight from Heathrow to Istanbul staged a revolt prior to take-off after Ahmed claimed he was being separated from his family and would be killed.
Ms Harper was hired by Ahmed’s London lawyers, Wilson Solicitors, to give evidence in 2021, it is understood
Appearing at a First-tier immigration tribunal in West London, Ms Harper reportedly told judges that Ahmed could be targeted by terrorist group al-Shabaab because it would want to punish him for raping a 16-year-old girl in the UK.
She is said to have claimed he could be harassed by Somali security forces and would struggle to find a job in Mogadishu’s construction industry because he lacked the right skills.
She also reportedly claimed that the Home Office plans to fly Ahmed to Mogadishu on a charter flight and put him up in a safe hotel would wrongly mark him out as a spy.
The BBC is facing questions about how Ms Harper was able to give evidence as an employee of the broadcaster.
“@worstall’s comments section has gone and got itself elected”
Mind you, it’s not the same without Mr Ecks, bless him. He could have been Interior Minister.
Anyway, bags I Minister for Swaggering about in Warmer Places in Winter.
“I think it depends on what we mean by mature.”
Indeed, Steve. And the Argie establishment are gunning for him. But if he fails because he does the right things in the wrong order and/or in the wrong way (cf Liz Truss), then it is better to learn maturely from his mistakes than to take refuge in conspiracy theories.
Theo – sure, but they’re conspiracy facts now.
We know they’re out to get us, and they know we know.
I hope the Argie has a posse.
Nope.
The Isle of Man issues it’s own currency at parity to the UK pound and holds UK Sterling reserves to cover every Manx pound in circulation.
Surely, dollarisition just means they’ll be using the dollar as a token of value in commerce within the Argentine economy. It doesn’t make them part of the US economy in the same way that the Euro does with the Eurozone countries. The value of the dollar will be set by the quantity of goods & services it’s exchangeable for within the Argentine economy. There’s no reason for that to reflect US prices except in the case of imports. But then that’s true of any country & its currency.
The advantage is the Argentine government won’t get the opportunity to print the stuff & so set that exchange rate with goods & services. The market will do that.
It reflects back to that discussion about government imposing digital cash. You can evade it by using someone else’s cash. Doesn’t matter which one as long as there’s consensus around it being exchangeable in commerce. The commerce itself will set its internal value.
BiS – Yarp, it’s not like he’s trying to become the 51st State.
Sovereignty would be nice, but that’s not what central banks are about.
Steve,
“She is said to have claimed he could be harassed by Somali security forces and would struggle to find a job in Mogadishu’s construction industry because he lacked the right skills.”
You have to wonder about people who will spend their time trying to stick up for the rapists of deaf teenagers. Like, if you’re a lawyer, that’s your job. Everyone deserves a defence. But beyond that? Couldn’t she get some work doing something more moral, like promoting big tobacco, kitten stompers or Westlife?
Maybe she, and many like her, consider it morally imperative to destroy Western civilisation. It would explain so much about the bbc, for example.
Maybe she, and many like her, consider it morally imperative to destroy Western civilisation
Puts me in mind of a conversation last week. We were a fairly mixed group of ex-pats. Us two Brits, a Dutch, a Lithuanian & I think a German. This superannuated Californian valleygirl imposed her presence & started banging on about the plight of the “poor Palestinians”. So we decided to conduct a quick opinion poll. The consensus was nuking the entire Middle-East to radioactive glass with a 4 to 1 majority of including the women & children. She departed somewhat unhappy.
Parliament could put a stop to this by passing just a few words into law.
“The welfare of the offender after deportation shall not be taken into account by any Court.”
Simples. Squeak.
@John Galt regarding the Isle of Man.
Round numbers the UK is 80* the size of IoM and has printed 800bn GBP of Quantitative Easing in the last 20 years. Numbers chosen to make the arithmetic easy.
To keep the parity sensible has the IoM Bank done 1bn Manx Pounds of Quantitative Easing or money printing in that time? Is it even allowed to.
Doh – should say 800*
The HK$ has been pegged to the US$ since 1983. The Chinese even kept the peg after handover.
Bongo, are you sure that’s the Euro rather than its proxy variants in various iterations of CFA Franc etc?
The Bosnian currency is also tied to the Euro in the same way, as fixed 1:1 with the German Mark prior to Euro days.
– If he fails, it’ll most likely be because the Argie deep state is fortified against democracy.
This is why I prefer DeSantis over Trump; a proven ability to govern as a conservative in spite of the efforts of the liberal establishment (and get reelected). Not as much fun but it gets things done.
@Bongo
Quite a few countries have adopted the dollar as official currency:
Ecuador
El Salvador
Marshall Islands
Micronesia
Palau
Panama
Timor-Leste
Zimbabwe
Argentina will be the latest and largest.
Interestingly, two British possessions are on the list:
British Virgin Islands
Turks and Caicos
– The HK$ has been pegged to the US$ since 1983. The Chinese even kept the peg after handover.
That retention was not surprising since the Chinese Yuan was already pegged to the US$. I suspect it pretty much still is despite being officially decoupled in ’05.
Steve @ 10:45 am:
NB – if they’re offering you a £1K discount, guess how expensive the electricity is gonna be?
Seriously considering one of these:
https://hyundaipowerequipment.co.uk/hyundai-9kw-11-25kva-single-phase-diesel-generator-dhy9ksem/
Steve @ 11:19 am.
Mary Harper, the BBC’s Africa editor, was hired as an expert witness by lawyers representing Yaqub Ahmed, in an attempt to block his deportation to Somalia
White women seem to have more empathy with adult brown or black male rapists and murderers than they do with their own kith and kin. Very odd.
Looks like I’m out of my depth on this west African currency area, mainly former French colonies.
At least the proposal of Millei doesn’t violate the peace, easy taxes and letting the natural order of things path to prosperity.
Unless you’re going to Murph that and insist having your own currency is the natural order of things. A thought which I might seed into his brain if I can get a comment through on his blog.
@Jonathan: Don’t buy that cheap Hyundai sh*t. If you’re going to buy a generator, get a decent make, like Stephill, SDMO, FG Wilson, JCB, Caterpillar etc etc. They’ll be reliable and hold their value, those Hyundais with be worth bugger all in a few years, and probably fail on you as well. Buy the makes you see on building sites, they’ll be decent enough. You won’t see Hyundai there.
“White women seem to have more empathy with adult brown or black male rapists and murderers than they do with their own kith and kin. Very odd.”
Not really. Its their lizard brains kicking in – they want a strong man on their side to protect them. They think if they can cosy up to a violent psychopath they can make him ‘their’ violent psychopath, and thus he’ll only do rape and violence to other people, not them. Which being as many women are entirely self centred they don’t care about at all, as long as they are OK.
Also remember that while a 3 phase genny can supply single phase electric, it can only supply one third of the rated capacity in single phase.
Jim, thanks for the advice. Do they still make Lister/ Petter generators – used to see those on construction sites all the time?
We need a Public Inquiry into women…
In who’s world is a Peronist “centre-left”. Call it what you will, but it is not near any centre, left or otherwise.
Double Congrats Mr Milei
First for winning, second for causing another msm meltdown
Good article by Matthew Lynn: Javier Milei isn´t `hard Right´
. He could be Argentina´s free market saviour
. The unconventional president-elect’s proposals are eminently sensible
@John, November 20, 2023 at 8:05 am
Snap 🙂
BiS
‘The consensus was nuking the entire Middle-East to radioactive glass with a 4 to 1 majority of including the women & children. ‘
Shock!! Horror!! I thought I was the only one evil enough to think like that.
‘In who’s world is a Peronist “centre-left”.’ Barks, the last time I remember reading about them, they were deemed ‘fascist’, ie hard right. I suppose since Milei won, he has assumed that honourable position and they must now be deemed leftist.
Of course to me, fascists ARE centre-left. Just to the right of hard leftists like Stalin. Indeed I’d argue that fascism is the flourishing and fashionable political orthodoxy of the day.
Milei has come out and said “The Falklands must be returned to Argentina”, which I presume is for domestic consumption rather than a return to Cristina Fernández de Kirchner style ranting on the subject.
Not like they can do anything about it anyway, they haven’t got a pot to piss in as far as military adventures go.
Unlike Diego Garcia, I can’t see the deep state just handing over the Falklands to Argentina any time soon. It would still cause too much of a fuss.
@ Boganboy “Shock!! Horror!! I thought I was the only one evil enough to think like that.”
Yeah. I was a bit disappointed with the mamby-pamby German. But I suspect he was just trying to avoid being stereotyped.
– they haven’t got a pot to piss in as far as military adventures go.
As has been discussed on here before, if Milei is successful at turning Argentina around economically they soon will have some militarily pissable pots.
As has been discussed on here before, if Milei is successful at turning Argentina around economically they soon will have some militarily pissable pots.
Sufficient to mount an amphibious expedition against a (now) well-defended island, across several hundred miles of the S Atlantic? I’m dubious.