OK, so age of consent, under that it’s rape. Fair enough. But what if in one of the multis- it’s common for a relationahip to start under 16?
A man who raped a 12-year-old girl was acquitted by a court that deemed their relations formed “part of the cultural reality of the gipsy community”.
Under Spanish law, minors under the age of 16 cannot consent to sex. But the court ruled that the man, who was 20 years old at the time, should benefit from a legal exception.
The ruling in Ciudad Real in central Spain, holds that the relationship was “always consensual within the framework of a romantic relationship”, adding that the two were “close in age and maturity”.
The acquittal is the latest in a series of rulings in which judges have taken into account customs followed by some of Spain’s Roma population when dealing with cases of sexual assault concerning minors.
It was rape because she was 12. In the eyes of her community it – so we are told at least – it was a normal enough time to have selected a mate.
According to the ruling, the defendant said he did not know the exact age of the minor and discovered that she was 12 only when they went to the doctor about her pregnancy.
Prosecutors had asked for a sentence of 11 years for a crime of repeated rape against a minor.
However, the court ruled to acquit, describing it as “an undisputed fact [that] the relationship took place in the cultural and social context of the gipsy community, where marriages between very young people are frequent”.
Whose rules win? And how multicultural are we being if our culture overrides their?
Central Spain – meh.
Concentrate, with apologies to BiS, on our own population where multi-cultural norms in matters such as screwing twelve years olds are even more abhorrent. At least the gipsy appears to be taking some responsibility for his actions. Over here the perpetrators and their surrounding communities feel no shame, no need to change and both expect and receive kid glove treatment from law enforcement, judiciary, media and politicians.
It’s not hard to imagine that things will get a whole lot worse following Julys election with the government increasingly in hock to such minorities.
Whose rules win? Are you serious??
School is compulsory until age 16 in Spain, but I assume that is also widely disregarded in the gypsy community. It’s the broken windows theory: if you allow minor infractions to go unchallenged, major crimes will be committed. The girl wouldn’t have been married off if she was in school.
What if it’s acceptable in their culture to steal from other cultures? Or even murder people in other cultures when you’ve been offended?
It’s custom for people in “some” communities not to pay any taxes and derive their income from nicking anything that isn’t nailed down. No doubt this behavior will soon be officially condoned as being a cultural norm and people objecting to it will be charged with inciting racial hatred.
Their rules win, clearly, since he was acquitted.
The problem then being that you’ve just thrown a fundamental principle of law that “All are equal before the law” out the window and replaced it with “Some are more equal than others”.
I bet the Muslim’s are gleeful about the ruling, since it brings Sharia law for Muslims much closer (followed by Sharia law for everybody whether you like it or not).
“In A Multicultural Society Which Culture Rules?”
The culture that kills those that don’t obey their rules…
I know quite a few of our Gitano community. I’ve been invited to & attended their gatherings. OK if you like horses & flamenco. They’re most definitely not Pikeys or Romania’s Roma. There’s actually a degree of respect for them here. It’s the Brit community I steer clear of.
Andy F: ’It’s custom for people in “some” communities not to pay any taxes and derive their income from nicking anything that isn’t nailed down…’
Is the House of Commons really ‘a community’ though?
The most violent and aggressive one, Tim.
bis:
I knew (through work) a few travellers in the UK – teenage girls in further education . They were doing child-care courses as it got them a bit of money from the state before they got married, and they had been persuaded by a clear-sighted colleague in education that they would pick up some useful skills for a life of children and housework.
They were fairly terrifying, but one thing that struck me was how they had a very conservative sexual morality. There were double standards for the blokes, to some extent, but all these girls were adamant that they would not sleep around and the ideal was to only ever have one sexual partner, who was the father of their kids. They may not have been the norm, but they did seem a lot happier than the average 16-year-old F.E. female student, who tends to be neurotic and remorseful about sexual encounters.
“…all these girls were adamant that they would not sleep around…”
Probably because they knew someone would kill them if they did.
PMcF
Probably. In all other respects they lived down to the stereotype: aggressive, violent, foul-mouthed, dishonest, thieving, etc.
There were cases of ancient empires having different laws and legal systems for different peoples.
Never mind “ancient”, how did the East India Company manage things? We all know the stories about abolishing thugee and suttee. Did they, on the whole, leave things alone otherwise? I suppose they abolished slavery at some point, did they?
Their culture always wins…
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2268395/Adil-Rashid-Paedophile-claimed-Muslim-upbringing-meant-didnt-know-illegal-sex-girl-13.html
https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/west-yorkshire-news/grooming-gang-member-who-took-26235631
This very topic is discussed by https://thezman.com/wordpress/?p=32096
Huh? The social and cultural questions might be proper to bring up at sentencing, but the verdict should be as close to unambiguous as it is possible to be, since everyone involved has freely stipulated that the crime defined in the statute was committed.
If you start in with the idea that something is a crime for some people, but not for others, then the law becomes a farce and a mockery, nothing more than a popularity contest.
As we see currently playing out in New York, and will shortly see playing out in Delaware. If you want a banana republic – this is how you get a banana republic.
llater,
llamas
Can you self identify as a Spanish Gypsy?
Yeah, calling bullshit on that.
If you’re tupping a 12 year old, you know she’s a 12 year old.
One problem is the typical state blunt-instrument of using the single term ‘rape’ for a wide range of actions.
While an ‘age of consent’ is a necessary restraint against child predation, there is a clear difference between granting-ineffective-consent and the violent ‘or-else’ attack variety. And no, I’m not defending either, just pointing out they are rather different offences.
And as suggested upthread, the offence is still committed, but the sentence may vary based on circumstance. This ruling is that the law is not blind and not equal, and some are exempt from it.
Oh this is a dangerous precedent: she was much older than Aisha. Somebody should tell Cid.
Tim the Coder:
“Oh this is a dangerous precedent: she was much older than Aisha. Somebody should tell Cid.”
Excellent! Best of the day so far, Sir.
Vibrant diversity in East London this morning.
llamas – we are a Banana Monarchy.
> where marriages between very young people are frequent”.
Except that this wasn’t a marriage and wasn’t between ‘very young people’.
It was between a very young person and a 20 year old 8 years older than her.
Agammamon reminded be of something Tim Newman used to talk about:
“The half-age-plus-seven rule is a widely used guideline to determine the minimum socially acceptable age difference in relationships.”
It’s only a guideline but this relationship was way outside it,