If Trump chooses to threaten Denmark militarily over Greenland, Denmark cannot respond militarily. It does not have the scale. But it does have the sort of leverage that matters in the modern global economy because Denmark is not just a small NATO state of about the size of Scotland; it is also a critical supplier of medicines to the United States, and the US healthcare system is built in a way that makes rapid substitution for the drugs it supplies nigh on impossible.
The most significant of its pharmaceutical exports is insulin. Reported trade figures suggest that around 74% of US insulin imports (by value) come from Denmark. That is not a marginal share. It effectively means that the USA is dependent on Denmark for the insulin it needs, with no alternatives being available, and millions of Americans require that insulin continuously. A disruption in supply would not, then, just be an inconvenience. It would not even create rationing. It could create clinical harm and a domestic political crisis.
And from this we will get to a critique of neoliberalism!
This is globalisation backfiring on the USA. The usual claim is that markets optimise supply chains and diversify risk. That story is false. The reality has always been that, at a global level, markets concentrate profits and, in doing so, often concentrate production. Denmark is where that concentration of insulin production has ended up.
Abject fucking tossery, of course.
It’s 74% “of imports”. The vast majority of insulin used in the US is produced in the US. True, true, Novo Nordisk – a Danish company – is one of the three major producers. But they produce inside the US as well as in Denmark.
But Spudnomics, see?
Europe is morons. US protects Europe. US says it needs Greenland to provide adequate protection. Europe freaks, sends troops to Greenland. Europe is driving American exit from NATO. Freakin’ suicide.
Considering European decadence, Gamecock is okay with that.
It sent some (15?) fact finding personel to scope out a potential military exercise to practice defending Greenland from the threats Trump says it faces. I don’t think the freaking came from Europe.
I very much doubt the US wants to be without its bases in Europe but, hey, it’s Trump so who knows what Tuesday will bring?
Fact finding personnel? Hilarious.
scope out a potential military exercise to practice defending Greenland from the threats
As if that were remotely possible.
Russia has accused Europe of militarizing Greenland. Door open.
Yes, “reconnaissance team” was the official term used, which was ridiculous for people carrying briefcases. (plus I had to look up how to spell it)
Yes, it is rather remote isn’t it?
Lol, fifteen extra bods added to the fucking gigantic American base that Europe has already militarised Greenland with.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@76.5295116,-68.7170693,9226m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en&entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI2MDExMy4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D
FFS
Boy Scout trip. Big fun.
It sent some (15?) fact finding personel to scope out a potential military exercise to practice defending Greenland from the threats Trump says it faces.
Did they now? Looks like they were hastily sent as a PR stunt to pretend Europe’s dick still works.
2 days later, the Krauts have already gone home, but they probably gathered loads of facts during their 48 hours in the snow.
Obviously it was a PR stunt. It was as silly as Trump’s justifications.
It was also ill-advised, but because Trump not because “door open” for Russia. The best thing to have done was nothing publicly.
Yes, I do think the Danes were foolish to run under Mama Ursula’s skirts, and the EU/UK (why is this the UK’s business?) are foolish for taking a peevish Council employee with a clipboard and ODD approach instead of a “show me your offer” approach. (Why does nobody want to see the offer?)
They hate Trump and don’t want him to ever get a “win”, which is an entirely irrational basis for foreign policy but here we are. But it’s also a lot easier to deal with Le Trompe than they’re making it look.
The guy’s a dealmaker, but people insist on talking the language of “international law” (i.e wanky lawyer roleplay) or “international norms” (i.e. Let’s Pretend for debate club kids) to him instead of talking business. No wonder he gets annoyed.
You know who else sends out ‘fact-finding’ personnel?
We do – when we’re looking to get a war started after one of them gets shot at.
A good summary
Sky is black with chickens coming home to roost
6 decades plus of US taxpayers’ Defence Spending subsidising EU benefit junkies and the CAP
When the US says that, it is lying.
This could end up spectacularly bad for the USA. Having started from a position where Europe is miliarily weak, but would support the USA in confllicts, Trump seems to be making Europe consider the USA as at best an unreliable ally, and maybe even a potential enemy. If this makes Europe return to military strength, the USA could find itself in a world where it faces China, Russia, and Europe. And Europe is over double the size of the USA with over double the population.
But there is no “Europe” in that sense. Militarily it is still a collection of states with disparate forces and competing arms industries. Good luck bring that together.
Didn’t work in 1943, so it’s not gonna work.
If this makes Europe return to military strength,
Laconia laughed.
There is no possibility of Europe returning to military strength in any meaningful way.
Apart from anything else, if you think that German, Italian, Spanish, Swedish, Czech, Polish (etc) troops can possibly operate together in combat in any meaningful sense you are sadly mistaken.
‘What did he say? It sounded like the Americans are dancing on wet planks, send three and fourpence.’
Europe is militarily weak – so what does their support in conflicts mean? What value does it bring?
Trump clearly sees that ‘Europe’ is run by a political class who hate their own people and countries and are busily engaged in destroying them through a combination of third-world immigration, de-industrialisation and insane energy policies. Trump’s endgame is to get Western European peoples to get rid of their malignant rulers and replace them with something better.
If Trump wants to make a cunt of himself over Greenland, let him. He should take his meds.
The question of whether he is or is not making a cunt of himself over Greenland depends entirely on where or not he’s right about its strategic importance.
Three (or maybe four?) previous US presidents thought it was important, and the things which made it important (to them) seem only to have accelerated.
A lot of people would think Trump was ‘making a cunt of himself’ over curing cancer if he did it.
So, the Greenlanders don’t want to become American. That’s the wrong question to ask them. The right question is along the lines of, “Which would you most like to be; American, Russian or Chinese?”
An even better question would be “how rich would you like to be?” Five years of the total wage bill for Greenland is about the cost of one US aircraft carrier. Make the people of Greenland an offer.
A US economics podcast I Iisten to suggested writing a cheque (check in US, I know) for $1m and stapling it to a Green Card and sending one to every adult in Greenland.
ohhh. yes but remember the Greenlanders have a Scandy benefit system. They won’t get that being snowy puerto rico.
And free healthcare. Whether that’s worth giving up for $1,000,000 is an open question.
It’s not likely to be ‘$1 million and you can never earn again’.
It’s more likely to be ‘$1 million and carry on doing what you’re already doing lads’, so yes, I think sensible Greenlanders given the choice between free healthcare and a million dollars (from which they could pay for insurance) would choose the million dollars.
Not to forget that the offer might end up being a million dollars AND free healthcare.
USA used to have 17 bases in Greenland.
They shut 16 of them as unnecessary
But that was last week.
BTW:
USA according the below can have as many bases in Greenland as it wants, whenever it wants.
Defense of Greenland: Agreement Between the United States and the Kingdom of Denmark, April 27, 1951(1
avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/d…
Yes, it has seemed strange from the beginning, as US had universal military access to Greenland all along. But Trump always seems to have good reasons for what he does, so I give him trust that he knows what he is doing, even if I don’t understand it.
Trump is a twat. Just because Biden/Harris are also twats doesn’t mean their opponent is the 9 dimensions chess grandmaster people think he is.
Chip bans to China (both Biden and Trump) have just led to China creating their own rival chip industry. No-one could be that bothered competing before. Just buy the chips from the Yanquis. Threats to your supply? Start making rival chips, rival fabs, rival chip design software to protect your industry. Next thing, they’re going to come for ARM and Intel outside of China.
Trump is a twat
No doubt we all are, when out to get things we want. But there’s nothing twattish about being ambitious for your country.
The Greenland Acquisition, if Trump can pull it off, will be the biggest expansion of the USA since the good old days of the Louisiana Purchase and the Alaska Purchase. Legacy making stuff. Trump gets mocked for his love of prizes and medals – but he’s putting the hard yards in to deserve them.
Trump is a real estate developer, he understands the value of property. Greenland is worth a fortune under the right management, but more importantly, it would show a world flirting with “multipolarism” that the United States is back, baby.
This is why he offends Europeans and Canuckians so much – we’ve gone without leaders for so long, we’ve forgotten what leadership looks like. Trump’s Greenland plan is bold and heroic, the kind of thing songs get written about. While EU/UK politicians compete over who can reduce your turnip rations the fastest, Trump is reshaping the map of the world like a 19th century robber baron. What a man.
Yes, vanity is the most likely explanation. After all, he paints himself orange and fusses his thinning locks into a big bouffant.
Even the “worse” predictions for global warming leave the place covered in ice for the rest of this century, and building the infrastructure to get stuff out will cost more than the stuff is worth. Acreage bragging rights is all there is.
America gets everything it needs from Greenland under the current arrangement and Denmark pays for the upkeep.
Lol, the world isn’t flirting with it, it’s being dumped into it by the USA walking away from being the monopole. It has chosen to no longer be the worlds policeman. In the words of Captain Bryant, “If you’re not cop you’re little people”. Make America Small Again.
Yes, vanity is the most likely explanation. After all, he paints himself orange and fusses his thinning locks into a big bouffant.
You should have seen Disraeli.
Even the “worse” predictions for global warming leave the place covered in ice for the rest of this century, and building the infrastructure to get stuff out will cost more than the stuff is worth. Acreage bragging rights is all there is.
Exactly what people said about Alaska – Seward’s Folly.
Lol, the world isn’t flirting with it, it’s being dumped into it by the USA walking away from being the monopole. It has chosen to no longer be the worlds policeman. In the words of Captain Bryant, “If you’re not cop you’re little people”. Make America Small Again.
What a strange set of claims. The US has, of course, recently taken rather bold actions in the Middle East, Iran, Venezuela and they’re still funding our favourite proxy war with our greatest ally, Ukraine. Doesn’t sound like retirement to me.
How does one make America small whilst embiggening it? A mystery.
European weakness is EXACTLY why Trump wants total control of Greenland. Trump considers it strategic; EU cannot defend it.
I think he sussed out a long time ago that the EU is not an ally of the US, it’s an enemy that poses as a friend.
The EU has been trying to fuck your tech industry forever, they hate your freedoms (ironically it wasn’t Saddam) and are determined to wipe out freedom of speech, freedom of religion (except Islam) and freedom to own property in their failing economic zone.
When the EU mewls about the US being an “ally”, they mean they hope Americans will still spend the blood and treasure required to defend Europe, while they snigger at how backwards and unsophisticated you are.
“No doubt we all are, when out to get things we want. But there’s nothing twattish about being ambitious for your country.”
Sure, but do you get rich owning a freezing cold rock, or making better software?
“The Greenland Acquisition, if Trump can pull it off, will be the biggest expansion of the USA since the good old days of the Louisiana Purchase and the Alaska Purchase. Legacy making stuff. Trump gets mocked for his love of prizes and medals – but he’s putting the hard yards in to deserve them.”
If size of land mattered, Brazil and Russia would be much richer than the UK. Owning land that is scorching hot or freezing cold isn’t worth much, unless there’s lots of mineral wealth under it. You can’t easily farm there, people don’t want to live there. Which produces more wealth? Wiltshire or the highlands?
“Trump is a real estate developer, he understands the value of property. Greenland is worth a fortune under the right management, but more importantly, it would show a world flirting with “multipolarism” that the United States is back, baby.”
What’s the value of Greenland in unexploited dollars per year? Whether that’s agriculture, minerals, tourism, or something else? About 50,000 people live there.
“This is why he offends Europeans and Canuckians so much – we’ve gone without leaders for so long, we’ve forgotten what leadership looks like. Trump’s Greenland plan is bold and heroic, the kind of thing songs get written about. While EU/UK politicians compete over who can reduce your turnip rations the fastest, Trump is reshaping the map of the world like a 19th century robber baron. What a man.”
This is what I’m talking about. People see Trump as the solution because he is antithetical to the others. But that’s like saying that spending all day in a sauna is a lot better than spending all day in a freezer because it’s the opposite. Leadership in the wrong direction is a bad thing. The Swiss are richer than us, but can you name who is their president without looking? Do they have territorial ambitions for Colmar and Milan?
When countries invaded others in the 19th century or earlier, it was about good land. We were much more interested in Aquitaine than the French were in Kent. People fought over Northern Italy for much longer than Switzerland. It’s why the Swiss don’t bother with an army. Who wants the shitty land?
Sure, but do you get rich owning a freezing cold rock, or making better software?
I thought you might say that. Real wealth is physical. The Internet and its consequences have surely been a disaster for the human race, not least because it’s encouraged a false idea that wealth can just be virtual numbers in the register of a CPU. But good luck buying radiation medicine or ammo with Dogecoin after The Event.
We are living in a material world, and I am a material girl. Gold, oil, gas, metal, radioactives, land – these are wealth. Imaginative and ambitious men can turn Greenland to good use.
Leadership in the wrong direction is a bad thing
Sure.
When countries invaded others in the 19th century or earlier, it was about good land.
Well, land is valuable and they’re not making any more of it. But nb our 19th century wars weren’t all about land grabs. We didn’t fight the Russians in Crimea because Britain wanted to take Crimea, for example.
“I thought you might say that. Real wealth is physical. The Internet and its consequences have surely been a disaster for the human race, not least because it’s encouraged a false idea that wealth can just be virtual numbers in the register of a CPU. But good luck buying radiation medicine or ammo with Dogecoin after The Event.”
Well, some wealth is physical. But most wealth is industrial. I’m not only saying software, although I’m guessing the damage to software companies in the US would outweigh the value of Greenland. But the cost of developing a cancer drug is almost entirely in the human labour that goes into it. We know this because of how fast prices of drugs fall when they go generic. And most of the price of an aspirin isn’t in the raw materials, but the added value of the producer and distributor.
Well, some wealth is physical. But most wealth is industrial. I’m not only saying software, although I’m guessing the damage to software companies in the US would outweigh the value of Greenland.
But what’s the value of Greenland? Short term: about a billion and a half pound per annum of shellfish exports? Long term, Trump might be thinking it could be a new Alaska. Strategically priceless US territory to permanently ensure Russia can’t expand, worth several gold mines in oil and gas, mining rights and agriculture. Who’s to say he’s wrong? Alaska used to be a worthless frozen peninsula too.
COVID also showed global supply chains fall over at the slightest breeze. Implications?
The Greenland Gambit is a big balls move by Trump and I’m surprised anyone doesn’t respect the hustle. I’m a yuge, yuge fan and can’t wait to see the next episode. It’s guaranteed to be funny. He’s got all our favourite European and Brit politicians jumping like fleas in a microwave, and Guardian columnists crying and wanking that the EU needs to do a war with America.
All because of an old man’s mean tweets and obviously hollow non-threats (he “won’t rule out” invading Greenland just like he never promised not to nuke France or kidnap the Pope.) They shouldn’t have given him an excuse to go back to the tariffs slipper, but they made Big Daddy’s hand itch.
“But what’s the value of Greenland? Short term: about a billion and a half pound per annum of shellfish exports? Long term, Trump might be thinking it could be a new Alaska. Strategically priceless US territory to permanently ensure Russia can’t expand, worth several gold mines in oil and gas, mining rights and agriculture. Who’s to say he’s wrong? Alaska used to be a worthless frozen peninsula too.”
Why would Russia expand via Greenland and not Finland, or over the Bering Strait?
And I have no idea if he’s right or wrong about Greenland having mineral rights, oil and gas. Have you surveyed it? Has anyone?
“COVID also showed global supply chains fall over at the slightest breeze. Implications?”
About zero considering what total bollocks Covid was.
“The Greenland Gambit is a big balls move by Trump and I’m surprised anyone doesn’t respect the hustle. I’m a yuge, yuge fan and can’t wait to see the next episode. It’s guaranteed to be funny. He’s got all our favourite European and Brit politicians jumping like fleas in a microwave, and Guardian columnists crying and wanking that the EU needs to do a war with America.”
I don’t because it’s stupid. It’s big balls to go into a bar full of black guys and shout “n*****s” but the outcome isn’t going to be good for you. What’s the expected outcome when Denmark says no? What happens next? Do the US go into Greenland? And what happens next, when the people of Greenland start a guerrilla war against them? When they get to 2000 dead like Afghanistan, do they decide it was all a bad idea and leave?
Trump is, to use the Freudian expression, pure Id. He’s like “this would be a good idea” and just announces it. Like when a terrier sees a rat, it just goes for it, even if there’s a road in the middle. He has none of the ego/superego that regulates. Everyone who loves him thinks that he has some 9 dimensional chess grandmastery going on, but he still hasn’t built that wall, has he?
Wait a minute. They built their own chip industry in response to being cut off from America?
But we were told that cutting off trade would just mean Americans would have to do without the goods China makes. Its almost as if the world thinks America exists under different rules from everyone else.
“Wait a minute. They built their own chip industry in response to being cut off from America?”
They’re building one. They already have RISC-V chips that are being used for servers.
“But we were told that cutting off trade would just mean Americans would have to do without the goods China makes. Its almost as if the world thinks America exists under different rules from everyone else.”
Who told you what, precisely? What do you define as “cutting off trade” what do you define as “the goods China makes”.
Raising tariffs means that a Chinese EV is priced higher than a Yankee EV. It doesn’t mean that you don’t get an EV. It just means that you pay more for an EV because it’s made in Alabama instead of Zhengzhou.
Everyone who’s been screaming that Trump’s tariffs will destroy America because we’re incapable of going without Chinese manufacturing.
Nope. We were told there would just be no EV’s because Americans are too dumb to make anything here – which is why we need to export the manufacturing to other countries.
“We were told there would just be no EV’s because Americans are too dumb to make anything here”
Who exactly said that?
I guess Trump wants full control, not something Denmark agrees to now but could withdraw in the future.
But Trump always seems to have good reasons for what he does, so I give him trust that he knows what he is doing, even if I don’t understand it.
If I was going to Steel Man his argument it would something like:
Why should the US pay for its defence and by extension Europe’s defence when there’s all those resources there that Europe isn’t going to use in the misguided belief they are saving Gaia?
I think the reality is that he’s a politician and like all politicians he wants to leave a legacy and getting Greenland will be one hell of a a legacy. Furthermore, he knows he’s only got this year because he’s likely to lose the House and there’s an outside chance the Senate.
if he does lose them its likely the never Trump Republicans will gang up with the Dems and that will be the effective end of adventurism if not presidency.
Are the USA going to face guerrilla warfare, where any teenager might be carrying a bomb into a bar used by Americans? Or carry out the sort of SS reprisals against the population?
It’s completely barking.
Are the USA going to face guerrilla warfare, where any teenager might be carrying a bomb into a bar used by Americans? Or carry out the sort of SS reprisals against the population?
No.
Is there anyone in Europe, especially teenagers, with the courage to carry the bomb today? I mean, other than the Muslims?
Try it. How did all that Billy Big Bollocks talk work out in Iraq and Afghanistan where you pussied out after a few thousand deaths?
Its not about military access of the United States.
Its about denying military access to Russia and China.
The US can have as many bases as it wants, sure – nothing stops the Greenlanders from taking massive loans out with China to build airports and then being pressured into leasing them a base when the Greenlanders can’t pay back the loan.
Er, Denmark stopped the Greenlanders from doing exactly that.
That it got that far shows the Greenlander’s have a very different perspective on the danger that China poses to them.
And Denmark stopped it *this time*. We don’t want to have to rely on the Danes continuing to do so. They’ve got a propensity to becoming neutral at inconvenient times for us.
Ahem! The USA *stayed* neutral for another two years after Denmark was invaded…
Once you have paid him for insulin
You’ll never be rid of the Dane.
Manufacturing medicines takes some time to spin up. It has to be carefully controlled etc etc. But it ain’t THAT hard. It’s not like making the top end CPUs where hardly anyone makes the kit, or knows the process. China will get there with their own versions of ASML lithography machines. It’s not Clogland magic like Rembrandt and Hocus Pocus. But it will take time.
The Americans don’t have them either; it’ll take them time too.
First, force political clarity. Citizens should demand that their MPs and MEPs (where relevant) state, explicitly, whether they support practical European defensive independence, including coordinated procurement, energy security, digital resilience, and the fiscal capacity to fund it, and not just by standing with allies, but through concrete commitments. The point is to remove the option of hiding behind slogans.
I think we should all put little Greenland flags in our socials, but dear reader, do you now or have you ever cared about Greenland?
Personally I can’t sleep for fear that Greenland might no longer be a Danish government possession. I worry about the future of my children if the Common Fisheries Policy doesn’t apply to Greenland, and I think – after we’re done defeating Russia, naturally – we should gather powerful NATO allies such as Germany, Latvia and North Macedonia to fight American snowtroopers in the Arctic Circle.
I’m very fond of the Danes and Denmark. Did a couple of trips there in my youth, and I’ve worked with a few (Umbraco comes from Odense). I always say they’re the closest people to the English in Europe.
If you watch Another Round, that’s a movie that could only be made in England or Denmark. We share a common bond around getting a bit pissed, like no-one else does. The French don’t go out and have half a dozen pints and put a traffic cone on a statue. But you get further north and they’re all obsessed with not drinking.
Do Danes even care about Greenland? The place has zero purchase on the European imagination, I’m sure most people didn’t even know it was technically Danish territory until recently.
Not exactly sacred clay, except to the Eskimos, eh? Greenland seems to be about as important to people on this continent as Rockall – Rockall has provoked minor diplomatic arguments in the past, but nobody actually cares about Rockall because why would you? It’s just Rockall.
Do the British even care about the Falklands? The Danes have been in Greenland since about 900AD. Which is about 800 years longer than we’ve been in the Falklands. And we killed 700 Argentine blokes over it before they decided it was a bad idea.
Do the British even care about the Falklands?
No, people don’t even think about it unless they have to.
The Danes have been in Greenland since about 900AD.
Should have built more longships.
The Danes have been in Greenland since about 900AD.
That is a load of bollocks. Greenland was settled out of Norway. For the reason why, look at a map. But in any case the modern Denmark is fairly recent. It’s the result of the fission of the Norwegian- Danish Kingdom in 1814. Denmark got Greenland from Norway because it had more clout at the time. Greenland is really Danish because of historic lack of interest. It wasn’t good for anything. If British North America had claimed it, it’d be Canadian. Nothing the Danes could have done about it. Or likely wanted to.
That was a different time with a different PM. In those days it was a workout for the infantry and a warning that we were still to be reckoned with, a bit.
The only thing stopping Starmer giving it away is he’d be giving it to Milei.
But yes, it has value – oil obviously to name but one.
How much oil
A few billion barrels
AFAICT Denmark’s claim on Greenland is as historically justifiable as the UK’s claim on India. Most Greenlanders would like independence, but they’re clearly not a viable state.
Denmark accidently ended up with Greenland in the divorce from Norway, the original colonisers. It’s like finding you’ve ended up with the ex-wife’s record collection and she’s replaced them with CDs.
Globalisation does indeed backfire
That is why Trump is doing something about it
What is Europe doing? Other than importing the 3rd World?
In which Two Tier’s government fucks around, and finds out:
Trump says 8 European nations face tariffs rising to 25% if Greenland isn’t sold to the U.S.
Published Sat, Jan 17 202611:36 AM EST
President Donald Trump said eight NATO members’ U.S. imports will face escalating tariffs “until such time as a Deal is reached for the Complete and Total purchase of Greenland.”
The tariffs will start at 10% on Feb. 1 and shoot up to 25% on June 1, Trump said.
The tariffs target Denmark, Norway, Sweden, France, Germany, the United Kingdom, the Netherlands and Finland, Trump wrote on Truth Social.
Told ye ODD wouldn’t work on Trump.
The two dogsleds the British Army sent to Greenland are turning out to be very expensive. Why are we doing this again? Greenland isn’t British territory and we’re not part of the EU. Britain likes to give away valuable real estate and pay other countries for the privilege, so why are we allowing ourselves to harmed for the sake of 19th century Danish colonialism?
This is all v well, but if bloke A says to me that if I do not agree with him then he will harm me, well, my back is got up. My instinct then is to say that I do not agree with him (regardless of what I actually think). Because he has pissed me off, and because I think I might have to deal with a twat who needs to be put back in his box.
I’m not particularly expressing a view about Greenland, the EU, or Yank ambitions. And, for the most part, I’ve been a Brit Trump fan.
But when people start getting gobby in my face, yeah … that does not work. At best, I’ll shrug and ignore them. At worst, I’ll tell them to piss off. (and maybe that is the 4D chess plan?)
I concede that we in this country are entirely hollowed out, economically and militarily moribund, and that is on us. Europe is, if that is possible, even worse.
But still, I, personally, have my national pride, just about.
It’s the same national pride by which, had I been alive at the time, I’d have concluded no later than Suez that the Yanks are not necessarily our friends.
but if bloke A says to me that if I do not agree with him then he will harm me, well, my back is got up.
Why are we getting our backs up over Greenland? Literally NOMFUP
But still, I, personally, have my national pride, just about.
Greenland isn’t part of our nation, so why did Two Tier decide to insert himself in a disagreement between the US and EU?
Fo’ sho. But I was not getting my back up about Greenland.
But I do get my back up about being threatened with harm* for not picking OMB’s side on Greenland.
We could as a nation have chosen not to take a side. But OMB’s threat will not allow that. We must back him, or he will harm* us.
Sod that.
*For a certain value of harm: his tarifs may cause Muricans more than they do us.
We could as a nation have chosen not to take a side. But OMB’s threat will not allow that. We must back him, or he will harm* us.
But the British government already took a side, which was to run to the EU’s side to frustrate Trump over a territory that is:
* Not British territory
* Not on the same continent as Britain
* None of our business
The tariff threats are a consequence of that. Peter Mandelson would never have blundered into this trap, but they cancelled him.
The whole thing is hilarious, a Gilbert and Sullivan farce without the tunes.
O/T Reform now has enough MPs to claim rights to appoint life peers. Murphy must be wondering if he backed the wrong horse.
The Jenrick Gambit deserves more serious attention than it received.
He’s an interesting man, not due to his personality or anything but because he was a fully paid up member of the Remainer/Infini-immigration/Net Zero political establishment who took the boldest political stance I think we’ve ever seen since Enoch Powell.
Unlike Powell, I don’t think he’s one of those unhappy people motivated chiefly by concern for their fellow countrymen and a self-harming devotion to telling the truth. That’s what makes him interesting. If the canniest wind sniffers in Westminster are going nativist, that’s a data point that summat is happening, tectonic plates are grumbling.
In their desperation to turn it into a negative headline for Reform (Brexit Man Bad), the press completely forgot to ask what it means. For the Tories, it surely means doom.
Have you seen this?
A Conservative source said Rosindell’s departure was a prime example of Farage doing the “spring cleaning” of Tory leader Kemi Badenoch, and Reform was “welcome” to him.
It’s a shit situation for the Tories, but they’ve started sounding like a scorned woman and I don’t think that’s going to help them either.
If Starmer had an ounce of sense he’d sell Chagos to Trump. US has had adverse possession for more than 50 years, which Mauritius hasn’t. (It’s only Mauritius because the old colonial office lumped the islands together for administrative convenience)
Trumpy baby. we’ll give you Chagos is you give us a few billion and a tariff deal.
Denmark needs its head examining. Its got a grade AAA chance to make Denmark one of the wealthiest countries on earth, and all for a plot of land they do nothing with, never have, never will. And that may well never be useable anyway if all the b*llocks about global warming is just that, b*llocks. $700bn has been mooted as a price, with a bit of negotiation they might get that nearly up to $1tn. Thats over twice their GDP. They could create a top 5 sovereign wealth fund straight off the bat, for no effort whatsoever. It could generate enough income to fund half its current annual government expenditures.
If I was a Dane I’d be yelling at my government ‘Just sell the bleeding place to the weird Orange Man and be done with it, we’ll never get a better offer!’
Very much so Jim.
The 2016 Referendum on a sovereignty issue partly swung on the claim that the UK sent Brussels bumcrats £350million a week, say £5 per person per week or £20k lifetime.
Ireland, France and Denmark have had a second referendum on EU treaties which went to Remain second time around for a small swing in subsidies.
There’s more to those votes than that but it shows that people’s views can be bought and for a very reasonable price
The Inuits and Danes should name their price.
Massive assumption there.
Is it actually Denmarks to sell FFS.
What if it’s an autonomous self governing nation within the Kingdom of Denmark.
“Governance: Greenland has its own parliament, the Inatsisartut, and a Prime Minister (currently Múte Egede), while the King of Denmark, Frederik X, remains the ceremonial head of state. ”
Could we sell New Zealand to the Yanks cos King Sausage Fingers is the head of state?
So it’s the Danish King’s to sell, personally?
Dunno, might well ackshully be the Greeenlanders to sell personally., thats what their wee PM and party seem to think.
The King Chuckles / NZ comparison was to make the point that there seems to be a segment of indigenous population who think they shoukd have a say.
Theres a spectrum from complete autonomy to disposable fraction.
Not sure where greenland lies on that spectrum and not sure how acceptable to US opinion the idea of indigenous Inuit being allowed a say will be.
If the indigenous population are actually allowed a vote on their own future rather than being sold off, no doubt there will be copious sums held up that each Greenlander can grab.
Lot easier to bribe 60k Inuit than 5 million danes.
Countering this will be those warning the Greenlanders their grandchikdren will garner all the respect & affluence available to other US colonies such as Puerto Rico or American Samoa.
Could we sell New Zealand to the Yanks cos King Sausage Fingers is the head of state?
Shh! I’ve got an idea.
Trump’s Greenland gambit: I figured it out.
Trump 45 was not happy with NATO. Ordered members to get their shit in order. Little happened.
Trump 47 sees European states still haven’t done much. AND, the military state of Europe is so shitty, Putin was emboldened to invade Ukraine. Trump sees Ukraine war as EUROPE’S fault, not Putin’s. Y’all invited him in.
So, some time last year, Trump gathered his leadership team and asked, “How do we get out of NATO?”
“Germany will order us to get out of our air bases.”
“Fine. We won’t need those bases. We’re not going to defend Europe anymore. They will be on their own.”
“Denmark may order us out of Greenland.”
“Hmmm, that’s true. And Greenland will be at the corner of our new defense zone. I’ll have to see what I can do to get Greenland.”
Y’all are sofa king dead. Trump is executing NATO exit. Trump 45 told you what you had to do. You refused. Trump hasn’t forgotten. Now, it’s Trumps turn.
Europe: 750 million losers.
Your “figuring” left out that Trump tried to buy Greenland during Trump45. Try again.
Nor the Middle East? There is no US projection there without the European bases. For example, the US Navy has lost the capability to load its Vertical Launch Systems at sea, so without the Spanish base your ships have to go all the way back to the US to reload.
You could negotiate with the North Africans for bases but the infrastructure and politics are a little shitty. Have fun.
Plus your other allies around the world might think you’re actually batshit crazy unreliable and make their own deals with their devils because it’s safer. If I was Taiwan, I’d already be making a quiet accomodation with the mainland. I wouldn’t want my island destroyed on behalf of the United States of Cut’n’Runland.
Anyway, you’re just rubbing your thighs with a silly isolation fantasy.
Make America Small Again!
If I was Taiwan, I’d already be making a quiet accomodation with the mainland
Well, naturally, since they both claim to be the Real Slim China and the Taiwan strait can’t be held by the US Navy without a brutal Pacific war? Accomodations are usually better than wars.
the United States of Cut’n’Runland.
Like Connery in the mornings, I Sheeved myself.
That actually makes sense
Or, Trump tries to create situations where he has multiple options to “win”.
The Great Greenland Panic is to the US’s potential benefit in more than one way. If you acquire Greenland, gravy. But if you don’t, it sets Trump up to demand, and possibly get, other things he wants from Europe. Because they foolishly, mulishly, predictably made this an adversarial situation when they could have flattered and strung Trump along for years of negotiations, valued Greenland at a hundred trillion dollars, or just treated him seriously in the first place? If you don’t wanna sell, or he can’t make your asking price, even the most tenacious businessman will eventually give up for opportunities new. But non, Le EU had to send dogsleds.
They’ve also been frustrating his attempts to wind down the Ukraine war with (clever, from their pov) malicious compliance. Two Tier, Le Frog, etc. claim publicly to support the United States in its quest for peace, yadda yadda. So have to kick them back under the desk at a more opportune time?
Now, he’s putting a bit of stick about, making em jump.
I don’t think he’s ever seriously going to unwind NATO btw. He’s a real estate guy, not Genghis Khan. He restores things or makes them more beautiful and gold tasseled than you ever thought possible. But he’s 100% right that NATO needs to be a valuable alliance, not a rideshare club for the back of Uncle Sam’s tank. That means other NATO countries having effective militaries and not parade armies, and thus actual and not merely theoretical sovereignty. Looks to me like he’s basically offering the Europeans what they’ve always claimed to want, to put on their big boy pants and be partners rather than mere (social worker) clients of Uncle Sam. No wonder they hate him.
Of course, what I think the Euros need (Oz as well) is lots and lots and lots and lots of nukes.
Imagine if Latvia had as many nukes as Ukraine did before they so foolishly gave them to Russia. If Puke became obnoxious, they’d blow him to hell. (The weakness of this approach is he’d blow them to hell as well.) But naturally the US objection is they might decide to blow the US to hell instead.
Thus the US policy of effectively disarming their allies. Which leaves the US in the position of having to defend them. Though this policy has worked perfectly in Ukraine.
The Ukies got rid of their nukes. So when Puke invaded they needed to fight him hand to hand (or at least drone to drone.) Thus Trump can back them by selling them the arms they need. And eventually negotiate a peace that gives Puke a large part of what he wants.
He’s thus the hero who makes a huge profit out of the war, gives Puke a reward for his attack, and claims sainthood for stopping the war against the Ukies.
Though this approach hasn’t quite worked out yet!!
Why not just say “we’re leaving”? Withdraw troops, stop paying any money in?
It seems like a lot more hassle doing it this way.
(and I support the demand for NATO members to cough up more).
Fun to watch.
Ever played with a laser pointer around a cat? Point it at the floor, the cat chases it. Point it up a wall, cat goes nuts trying to get to it.
“It’s there!” “No, it’s over here!” “argh!!”
Many of y’all are cats. Trump has the laser pointer.
There will be no invasion, not of Canada, not of Greenland, not of the UK. There will be hysteria and wailing, and then there will be Trump holding the thing he wanted to hold in the first place.
And I’m not sure he really cares about world opinion anymore than he cares about cats.
Drat.
Dont know who did this